Ep. 92 - Duncan Trussell Returns

Hi, I'm Kelly McLean, host of the Dow of Comedy Podcast on MindPod Network. Following the sudden death of my brother, I found myself in need of a major existential search of the meaning of life and death and everything in between. I turned to some unlikely authorities to help. Comedians. I've had the honor of interviewing some of the best comedians in the world, like Pete Holmes, star of Judd Apatow and HBO's Crashing, Daily Show creator Madeline Smithberg, Bert Kreischer, The Machine, and podcasting guru Duncan Trussell. There is a living force in the universe that is completely in love with you.

It pines for you, and the more that you turn in its direction, the more synchronicities will happen in your life. Banana, smoked a pack and half a salamuday and dropped it on her kitchen floor at the age of 80 on her way to Bingo. That's kind of what I'm going for. I believe that the world is kind of a mirror. I believe in time travel. I believe in magic. I'm a miracle. I'm a goddamn miracle. I'm a Christmas miracle. The podcast is available on mindpodnetwork.com and taopodcast.com, the Dow of Comedy. every comedian is a secret sage. Our true identity is perfection and we've become lost in a cloud of data that has one of the side effects of being lost in the cloud of data called the material universe. It's forgetfulness of our true identity.

[Music] Welcome to episode 92 of Synchronicity and my guest this week features the return of Duncan Trussel. Do I really need to introduce Duncan? I just assume that if you're listening to this podcast, you know who Duncan is. If you don't know, Duncan is a podcasting savant. He's one of my favorite podcasters. I've said this before. I'm not a huge podcast consumer, which I know is kind of silly because I have my own podcast, and I run a podcast network, which has forced me to listen to podcasts. But I'm not a huge natural consumer of podcasts. Duncan's, however, is one I check out regularly just because the dude has a way of conversing with people and evoking this very powerful mysterious force that seems to guide us all, regardless of who he's speaking to. That's really awesome. In case you didn't know, Duncan's also the reason that this podcast exists, that MindPod network exists, and not just from like, "Oh, he was my inspiration." We were literally on a beach in Maui smoking some weed when he was like, "Hey, you should start a podcast network." That network now is called Be Here Now network. MindPod network is a little bit different, but still, it was the genesis of everything. For that, I owe him massive credit, and maybe a Charlie horse because it's also been very frustrating. I kid, of course. This conversation is really awesome.

You'll hear in the beginning here, I alluded to some professional trials and tribulations, and I'm not going to discuss it publicly, but you'll hear me say, "You know, I've been going through some stuff." I don't really have any intention of ever discussing kind of what happened. I'm sure some of you have gleaned that there has been some professional and interpersonal consternation over the past few years regarding who I was working with and kind of the whole podcasting thing. And yes, it's an interesting story, and maybe one day I will divulge, but until I figure out a way to make sure that it doesn't add to any dysfunction, and it doesn't create any more acrimony or kind of troublesomeness, I'm not going to speak about it because nothing can come, really can come from that. However, in this podcast, Duncan did a masterful job of reminding me of this concept that we are in a love affair with the universe, the world, the mystery, and love affairs are not always sunshine and roses. Yes, they feel great when you're in love, everything seems magical, it is magical. But there's also your vulnerable, your opening yourself up, you can be hurt, you can be let down. So this is kind of what we're doing with life. I love just getting out of the way and letting Duncan speak as much as possible. Also, on the topic of letting people speak, I got my first two star review on iTunes. Do I religiously check the reviews to see what people are saying? Yes. Is that a good thing to do? No. Why is it not a good thing to do? Because when you get a review, where the person says you talk too much, shut the F up, it doesn't make you feel good. So I mean, I'm sure you guys have also realized this in the podcast. I do like to talk. It's one of the reasons I have a podcast. Yes, these are interviews some of the time. But most of the time, I really do like to consider these conversations. That's what this podcast is. It's a conversation between me and someone I like or I think is doing something cool, preferably both. So it's for the people listening.

I know you guys all get this, you're tuning in. But this isn't just me asking the guest's questions and letting them talk. Like I'm a part of this too. So for the two star reviewer, that's not cool, man. Why you gotta do that? Why? Hey, you couldn't just bump it up to three. I'm not going to complain about my reviews in this episode. I'm sorry. Oh, I have a few updates last week. I was talking about creative evolution, the email course and how I dropped the price from $85 to $20. I lied. That's not true. I dropped it to $25. I had a few people asking about that. So if you see there, if you go to sync podcast.com/holyshit, you will see that you can sign up and it costs $25 in case you're wondering what I'm talking about. I make music. I write. I create things. It took me a really, really, really, really, really long time to get to the point where I could finish things that I had started when I come to creative projects. So I figured out how to do that. And I codified that system.

And now it's a course called creative evolution, which is launching in fall. So stay tuned for that. But if you want to take the email version of the course, which comes with a downloadable book at the end, you can do that at any point. Again, sync podcast.com/holyshit, you will see the course you can sign up, you will get it right away. So that's going on. And I want to clear up the price confusion. Another clarification. Last episode in the episode before, I said that there is going to be a mind pod network live event in New York City on August 17th. Wrong. There's still a live event. Don't worry. I wouldn't gas you up like that. And then just totally change everything and have it not happen. Now, the event is September 21st in New York City, same place, noi house. We're going to have tickets available. We pushed it back for a few reasons. One is August, mid August is kind of a dead time for the city.

It's not not the most active. So we wanted to make sure we were hitting this at the right time. The other reason is this allows us to bring in some other people who are some pretty big heavy hitters, both in the planning and the guest speaker capacity. So that's going to be really, really cool. Also, it's a new moon. I think it's the international day of peace. It's just it's lining up nicely. So September 21st, 2017, stay tuned for details. There will be tickets. It's going to be really cool. I hope to see you there. You'll be happy. Little aside, I don't want to tease it too much. If Duncan schedules schedule lines up, he will be at the event too. So yeah, anything else I have to say? I don't know. I love speaking with Duncan. I don't want to give the impression that we're the best of friends and we hang out all the time. We stay in touch routinely. He he is tipped me off to some amazing people.

Kelly McLean from the Dowell of comedy. She is she was in Duncan called me up one day and was like, Hey, I met this chick. She's really cool. She's talking about stuff. I think it's perfect for mine pod. Boom. Next thing you know, Kelly's on the network. She's incredible. So he's just been such a help through all of this. And whenever I see him, went to his place in Brooklyn, saw his two lovely doggies, whenever I see him, I just end up feeling a little bit better about life. And it's not like he's doling out like wisdom and you know, life lessons or anything. It's just he's got a presence about him where you can tell he's been through the muck and is still standing and still has something valuable to share.

And those again, that's like my favorite type of person. I don't want to see a shining, gleaming. Everything is perfect. Follow me type guru, you know, because I can't relate to that. That's not my life. So having this vulnerability and this authenticity, I think we even speak about this at one point in the episode is just a refreshing and helpful beacon for many of us who go through these oscillations of up and down in our lives. And maybe we're just trying to not stop the oscillations, but maybe have the pendulum swing just a little bit more narrow, maybe not have it go all the way to one extreme and all the way to the other. But you know, such is life. That's the way it works. That's it. I mean, if you if again, if you don't know who Duncan is, you can check him out at Duncan Trussell Family Hour, his podcast, he's doing a ton of live events at the Bell House in Brooklyn. So check there, stay tuned, you will see him pop up. I think he's got one coming up with Aubrey Marcus in the not too distant future, just the hell of a dude really, really had a great time spending. I was going to say had a great time spending time with him, which I don't know if that that really works as a sentence, but I'm going with it. So without further ado, no, jeez, what am I just going to get? No, no, no, no, no, no, I would be remiss if I didn't keep pointing out the patreon. The patreon page is going really well. Thank you to so many people. I think it's like 17, 18 of you now, just started a couple months ago who have contributed.

There are cool rewards there. If you want to get all the music you hear in this episode, episode, you can get that at the $9 level. Speaking of music at the end of this episode, I'm working on a remix of a cover of Wicked Game, Chris Isaac's Wicked Game. I'm very happy with it. It is turning out quite nicely. So if you want to hear that, stay tuned to the end after the episode you hear it. That's where all the kind of longer music in this show is, by the way. All right, now I'm going to be quiet. Without further ado, here is your favorite, my favorite, everyone's favorite, Duncan Trussell. Thank you for doing this, Ian. A pleasure. Thanks for coming over, man. Good to see you.

A lot of time, people ask me now, I get the question because I've done 90 something of synchronicity, my podcast. How did you start? I don't know. I actually, how did you start your podcast? How did that whole thing was Lavender Hour? What was the decision? We're going to do this because it's kind of fun. In the very early days of podcasting, my friend Matt Dwyer, and I think it was Matt Bronger, they were doing a podcast, but they're super cool ahead of their time. I remember sitting and thinking, "What the fuck is this? This is so fun and weird. I don't understand it at all." This is a year or so, way before, when it was the idea of even figuring out how to download a podcast and play, it was not as easy as it is now. There was no app for it.

There was enough. You had to figure it out on your own. It was kind of an underground art form, and then I was dating Natasha LeGero at the time. I told her about it. Maybe she had done a podcast. I think we ended up doing two different podcasts and realizing, "We should do one. This is fun. We'll just do it for no reason or do it once a month. Let's sit down and just talk. We'll invite people over. We'll just talk with them and see what happens." That was the beginning of it. That's how it started. Out of the blue, this guy runs a comedy club in Atlanta called The Laughing Skull. Marshall Childs called me up and was like, "Here's what's going to happen, Duncan. Cars are going to become equipped to play podcasts within the next couple of years. If you take it seriously and really start putting out podcasts right now, then you're going to be part of a wave of podcasts." It was the most amazing business advice of all time. It was like a time traveler coming into the past and being like, "Invest in Apple back in the '80s or something." It was amazing. I'm very grateful to him for that. I could feel it. I'm like, "Oh, yeah, he's right. I love doing this. We should do it more frequently." Then that's how it started. You started it with this idea of, "Let's just do this because it's fun. We're having conversation." That's right. It's going to be there. That was the genesis of it. Then it became potentially a practical tool for your life, revenue, your career. It was something that kind of fused together, which mimics kind of my situation because the whole reason I have a podcast, I share a lot of people all over the world credit you for the inspiration, but we were literally at the Rambas retreat. This is when the idea for MindPod Network was planted and you're like, "You guys should have a podcast now where I'm like, I'm just going to do that. You're like, just do it. It's a really good idea." I'm like, "You know what? It is a good idea." Then through that, through a string of events, I was like, "Okay, I think I could have a podcast." I think that would be pretty cool. The reason I bring that up is you know probably as well as anyone how the act of having a podcast and just having these conversations with people on a weekly on a regular basis really changes reality in a crazy way. It sounds like kind of like trite to some people are like cliche, but it really does just alter the shape of reality in a very poignant way, especially if it's a type of podcast like this where you're just having a conversation with someone and the dynamic energy that comes out of it. That's like what have you noticed throughout the years of doing this because you've had different podcasts. You've also had different periods of your life. You've gone through complete oscillations. What have you noticed has kind of been the interplay between having a podcast and speaking to people and your life out there? Well, it broadens your social circle by creating a formal place where you're going to have conversations with people that normally you would never interact with. You end up getting to be in the presence of a lot of different people, many different types of people, and inevitably from intermingling with people, you're affected by it.

So you will inevitably transform when you hang out with anyone, you'll transform. When you watch anything, you'll transform. Everything is transformative because we're in a constant state of transformation. I guess by injecting the presence of some pretty smart humans into your life in this formalized way, it gives you a lot of tools and shows you a lot of lifestyles that you can incorporate or not incorporate into your own. It helps. It broads like reading or anything else. Formal conversations are so important with anyone. It doesn't have to be Jack Cornfield or Rombas, anyone. Everyone's got this song that they like to sing and listening to people, seeing this song of their life. It's very poignant and it can change you. But change is an overused word anyway. Culture of changing your life is weird anyway. This is where this podcast is at at this point. A four or five weeks ago, I forgot how many episodes ago. You know me. I'm generally, I don't think you've been in my presence where I'm not abundantly optimistic and relatively positive about almost everything. But about like two months ago, a month ago, I was just like, "Pfft, I'm fucking part." I've tried so many different things. There's been, I've never spoken about it publicly, but the professional tumultuousions with my iPod network and some of these things. And I hit a very low point. And not everyone, if you haven't, you will get there at some point. You hit this point where it's like, "This is like everything isn't working. Everything is against me. This is it." And I'm really lucky and grateful that I have an amazing support system. Not only my immediately family and friends, but listeners of the podcast. When I hit that point, you know, the feedback was overwhelming and I was like, "Oh, this is really great." But it got me to the point where I started kind of questioning everything, right? This dark, the true dark night of the soul, not that things are difficult, but like, "Do I really even believe this?" And we've spoken about this. I think on the last podcast, and this is, this is why I bring it up. So I have never doubted from the time that I made the connection that Neem Krolli Baba was my guru, or someone who at least was there who I'm connected to in some type of way. Never doubted that ever. Even through times where I kind of conveniently wish I could have been like, "Fuck that shit. Are you kidding me?"

Like, totally not worth it. But it was getting to the point where it felt like even knowing that it wasn't enough to kind of buoy me with this kind of knowingness that there's this positive, loving energy and universe. So like, I know you mentioned on your podcast, you had been depressed recently, and you've gone through this shit publicly on air podcast before, like, what do you think? First of all, is there a practical function for that, or is it just like a malfunction? What's your take on that? It's like there's this continuum that is the human mind. Right. And the human thought process and the phases of awareness that you go through each day, and each month, and each year, and sometimes your mind shuts down, and you don't get any kind of nectar, bahve, or whatever the hippies call it. And so you feel numb, and like pointless, and you have these conversations, and you kind of fake it a little bit, and you're like, "Alright, yeah, sure, okay, yeah." And sometimes you're like, "Wow, this is amazing. Oh my God, my heart is opening. I'm crying right now. I can't fucking believe I get to feel this life." And so you get these two extremes, and then you become addicted to wanting to get these bumps of weeping as you're randomly weeping as you're driving your car. Right. Because you feel the grace of God in your life.

Right. Right. Which is a bump. You want to get a bump. Right. And it's like sometimes you don't get the bump, and if you associate a lack of intoxication regarding your attempt to bring positivity into the world with failure, or with fraudulence, or with hypocrisy, then you're losing track of what appears to be the job description, which is it really doesn't matter how you feel. Oh, you feel terrible? Well, you're a fireman. Go put the fire out. Oh, you feel like a hero? Well, go put the fire out. You know, that's it. Right. So the feeling thing, and sometimes I'm like, you know, I don't fucking know. Right. At all. Right.

Could be all random. Could be a grasping at straws and trying to assemble some pattern in the midst of ultimate chaos to fulfill a desperate need for a sense of purpose and an ultimately meaningless life. Right. Or it could be the opposite of that. But regardless, what is certain that people suffer, people suffer for sure. And because we know that people suffer, then what could be a certain way of acting? One certain way of acting could be, let's see if we can ease the suffering. Even if you're numb, if you're just fucking numb and you don't feel anything at all, if you're a sociopath, you feel nothing. Right. You could still logically deduce that less suffering is better than more suffering. I think it is. Is it? Well, so that's like the weird question. We live in this universe that is suffering, right? And this is the whole Buddhist and that doesn't mean that it's like some mopey, horrible place necessarily. But it's all around us, whether it's in our personal lives or like starving kids in Africa, it's everywhere, right? So the question isn't like, you know, this Rambas says this, I still quoted to this time, like suffering is the sandpaper of our incarnation, right? It smoothes us and this fits into this idea, which I think I subscribe to. I try to shake it even in my down times and it doesn't seem to go away, which is, I don't feel like anything anyone forced us to incarnate as human beings. I didn't feel like it was a choice against whatever consciousness we individually hold, whether we want to call it a soul or a mind, whatever it is, this individually, individuated type thing amongst us. So this is kind of feels like it's a training school in a lot of ways because the same, at least that might let the same type of problems come up. How do you forgive people? How do you let go of shit? How do you not react to stuff? How do you, you know, when something is objectively wrong, still maintain a sense of equanimity? Like this, and this is like everyone. This isn't like, oh, these are my unique individual problems. This is kind of everyone. So it feels like we're here to kind of smooth over those things.

And I guess what it, you know, there are so many pitfalls potentially with that because you're bumping up against culture, you know, capitalism, interpersonal stuff. And the trick is, is how do we maintain like, here's the question for you. What, what are you, you and knowing that I'm not pinning you down 100% to this? But do you believe that there is some loving, something that comes out of the emptiness that the Buddhist describes as like the union of emptiness in bliss or, you know, Ram Das would, you know, and would describe is, you know, these primordial architects of like Hanuman and this loving energy. Like, do you subscribe to that? Yeah. Like, what, what is, what's your idea? Yeah. Definitely. I completely described that. Right. I don't, I don't feel it all the time. And I don't see it all the time. Usually because of my own fixation on myself and because of an inflamed ego or something. Yeah, sure. Sure. Sure. You'll lose track. But I know, I just, this, I feel it. Right. Beyond feeling. And I know it beyond knowing. And I, and I have experienced it enough. Right. No. Yeah. And, and, and when I'm not experiencing it, I am experiencing it. And when I, if that makes any sense at all, it's all different sides of this beautiful love affair that is, for me, a very tumultuous one.

But ultimately, I have, I can't look at my life and, and think anything other than that, I'm so fucking lucky and that, that there feels like there's this grace there that I don't deserve at all. Right. I like that feeling. Right. It's, it's, that's what a gift is. If the moment a gift becomes something someone deserves, it's a paycheck. Right. It's an exchange. Yeah. Right. But when a gift is, when someone gives you something and you really think about it and you're like, not only have I been an asshole to you and not only have I thought terrible things and done terrible things, not only have I been like that, but sometimes I don't even think you're fucking there, whatever it is. And then this suddenly someone's like, listen, it's okay.

I mean, I really mean it's okay. Right. Here you go. Here it is. Here's everything. Right. Whatever that may be. Because the material manifestation of the energy is secondary to the experience of the energy itself. Yes. And that is cool. Because this is a conversation we're having. The conversation, Ramdas calls it a school. Sometimes I think of it as a school. Sometimes I think of it as a conversation, which is, let's imagine this alien lands, we're talking a super advanced alien man, like way more than whatever you've seen in science fiction, an entity that's 15 billion years in the future, 15 billion years in the future and conceivable. So it lands, it wants to talk to you. And it loves you because as part of it's whatever it is, it just fucking loves sentence. And it loves you. So it wants to come and have a conversation with you, right? How does that have a conversation? Well, it builds a universe. First of all, it creates the grammar of a universe. And then it puts you in the universe. And then in that universe, it appears as everything around you and begins to talk to you and has this conversation.

Because it's like, if you could pick, this isn't the Bhagavad Gita. Krishna reveals his universal form, incredible series of passages is Arjuna's describing this incredible form. Everyone's, you know, I see the world being devoured by you and people, holy men from all the ages, bowing down and saying, Oh, piece, piece, piece, piece. And then at the end of this, he says, can you please return to your regular four armed form, which is super funny. But in the same way, it's like, if you could choose how you wanted this being to talk to you in a way that wasn't going to freak your shit out, how would you choose? And this is why when I'm petting my dogs. And I realize, Oh, God, this is God. My dogs are gods. And God is so merciful that God has taken the form of these animals that are completely, completely dependent on me and completely love me. And this is a starter point for communicating with the divine. And then from that, you can kind of work your way up. Theoretically, in some other more advanced state, maybe you could begin to digest all the different archetypical forms that Krishna takes. But for people like me, it's easier to be like, it's my dog. Right. My dog loves me unconditionally. I love my dog unconditionally. And that's, that's the beginning of the relationship that expands into everything. And when you run into super advanced beings, you realize they think of everyone as right in the same way we think of our dogs. Right. Not in a condescending way. But like in that same sense of like, I love you. Right.

I don't care. Right. And that's pretty amazing. Like when you see the classic rescue dog scene, where someone who's really good with dogs, I've seen this beautiful thing on the internet, this beaten, abused dog is in the corner, growling at everyone, snapping, biting. Right. And someone walks sits in there, he knows how to deal with dogs. Right. And this emanating love. And the dog's like, I can't, it's all habituation. Right. It's growling. It's making these weird noises. And then gradually, gradually, gradually, the person gets closer. And then the dog just jumps in the person's arm. And it's like he's petting the dog and the dog's trembling. And that is what it's like when you run into a fucking asshole. Exactly. I was going to say that's it. Like we become the dogs or habituation. Like, I'm realizing this more and more. And I haven't, we're talking about a little before, you know, the statute of limitations on my last, you know, big psychedelic dose is long expired. So I haven't been launched into that reality in quite some time. And that's a nice way to kind of remind you of what you're talking about that there is this interconnectedness of everything. So when you say your dog is God, of course, so is everything in the room. So are you, like, that's really the message behind it. I've been trying to figure out how to unplug or if it's possible to kind of decode, first identify, this is why I think mindfulness is meditation is so important. You have to first be able to be aware that this shit is even happening in the first place before you can even begin to like relate to it in any way or any healthy way. But trying to like uncover the individual and collective kind of archetypes or mythologies that are really running everything like I personally just, I know and believe that what we experience consciously and egoically is just such a small little fucking sliver of literally everything around us. Like, just in the room, there's our eyes are picking up all this visual data, but we have to tune in to maintain a conversation. So we know that extends far out. So trying to get to the bottom of what these stories are. And as I've been doing that, just really over the past like couple of months, not that much longer. I just see the same shit. It's patterns. It's like, Oh, I act this way because that happened a really long time ago. And it became an effective strategy for people listening to me, even if it was me being crazy. So I'm realizing not only is that going on for me, it's going on for everyone too. Right. So it's kind of like, how do we bring that compassionate wisdom that clear seeing that you're describing like that person who knows how to talk to dogs and like is cradling the dog like that's that's an innate ability that they're communicating not through language or something else. It can come through that, but it's there.

How do we bring that type of awareness to these like sticky patterns and systems we've built up and like I'm still I guess trying to figure out a really effective way to do that. That doesn't keep me in a state of like everything is fucking great because that's unrealistic, but how to not get like thrown so much when the waves and the waters get, you know, rocky. Oh, well, hello, Synchronicity listeners, funny finding you in the middle of an episode of Synchronicity. I am here to tell you about the Facebook group for Synchronicity. We've got a Facebook page, of course, it's going well, but we also have a group where people ask questions about a variety of different things. They interact with each other, they meet other people, they plan stuff, and it's totally free to join. So if you're interested in joining a community of like-minded people who are doing cool stuff, go to synchpodcast.com, you will see the menu item, Facebook group, click there, ask to be joined. It's a private group. I will see you. I will take a look at you.

If you make the marks, you will be in. That's it. That's it. I'm gonna get out of the way and back to the episode, here is Duncan Trussell, being fucking awesome. They call it cultivation. So that's what it is. It's you have to cultivate something where you have to pray. A lot of people just forget to pray. I've just been doing it recently. It's it works. Yeah. And thank you is a great prayer, too. Yeah. It's a really good one. Yeah. Yeah. And you know what? Okay. So there's that great movie, Momento. Yeah. So the guy puts all the shit all over the wall to remind him of who he is. So because I think we are our true identity is perfection and we've become lost in a cloud of data that has is one of the side effects of being lost in the cloud of data called the material universe is forgetfulness of our true identity, right? So like in Momento, Momento, it's good to have shit around that reminds you of who you are and because you'll forget. And even, you know, I have stuff around that reminds me, but even then I forget. And so, but that's it helps to have things around to help you remember that where the paycheck is coming from. Because if you get too caught up in the paycheck and you start thinking the paycheck is coming from the world, then you'll go crazy because that's not where it's coming from. And by paycheck, I mean, whatever it may be, the release of neurotransmitters from your synaptic vesicles that make you happy or material success or success in love or success and whatever, you start getting confused because you think that the fountain is somewhere that it isn't, you start thinking the fountain is it is somewhere else. And then that's where you're like, well, you're done, you're lost, you're done, because now you begin to worship false gods as it's called everything's God, but you you begin to go to like places like you're like licking drops of water off the wall of a cave right next to a pool of the clearest, sweetest water that never runs out.

Right. So to remember this relationship is very important. And coming up with some technique of remembrance is a really good thing. So that, and even when you don't remember, even if you look and you see the picture of whatever it is that reminds you, Krishna, name curly Baba, and you look at it and you think, no, that was just a dream I had when I was a fucking stone. Even in that place, you pray and you could say, I am so lost right now that I don't even think you're in the room anymore. Yes, yes. I don't even believe in you. I don't even believe in you. Please, please, please help me remember. Please, please, please, please, please, I'm lost. And then it'll come. That's well, that's what I mean, that's what happened, basically. And I did even the worst thing. It wasn't even that I don't think you're here. I was like, why are you fucking me over?

Like, what fun? Like, what did I do? Did I, did I fuck up? Did I do some like thing that this is? Yeah, and then I think as soon as I started saying that over and over again in my head, I'm like, that's fucking ridiculous. That doesn't actually make sense. And then I basically did the thing that I think is really hard for a lot of us to do, which is just I just surrendered. Just like, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna pretend that I'm steering this ship anymore. And whatever happens, like, I, I know what my intention and aspiration, that's all right. Like, I at least know those. I've been lucky enough and blessed enough to figure out like, I do want to help, but I am not trying to bring more suffering into the world through my actions.

And I'm not trying to even use that as like a spiritual bypass, which I know is very often happens. I guess, you know, here's, here's something and I'm not, I know I'm treating you kind of like a therapist now, but I asked you because I know, you know, one of the best things and one of the reasons you've helped so many people is because you're so fucking honest. And in your podcast, like you are like, it's, you can tell. And you know, I know how it goes into recording intros and there's parts that, you know, that were great that maybe didn't make it and some that you don't aren't, but truthfully, you're honest. And that's, I've learned that's the one thing if you're going to do anything in life that evokes the most real change in the world, because people can tell it regardless. But yeah, I mean, like, what happened, what happens if this has happened to you? You know, like if you're in a relationship, right? You're in a relationship and there's a song that's your song between you and whoever you're with, right? You love that fucking song reminds you that, oh my god.

And then you break up with that person and suddenly that song becomes like the worst fucking thing. And it's like, you ruin the fucking song. It's even, you know, it's a good song. You're just like, you fucking ruined it. Yeah. Then that happens, but transpose in the spiritual world or whatever you want to call it. That's a mind fuck. And I think this happens more commonly, whether it's a false guru or whether it's just a difficult situation and something that is a positive community. How to deal with those things. I don't think, again, is a unique problem for me. I think it happens to a lot of people. And I think, I guess what you're saying here is still completely applicable, like even if you feel like you're drinking little drabs water on the cave, like you do always have access to some tools and reminders that this shit's going on. Yeah. Oh, that's all the past.

Anyway, I mean, the thing is that we're talking about this present moment connection with something and not a past moment connection. Again, it's like the past you start thinking about whatever it was and then now you're caught up in the, it's the difference between a snake skin and a snake. You're looking at this dried out snake skin and you're like, when this beautiful thing is with you right now. And that is the returning point. It's never, it can never be in the control of some group or individual or methodology because it's the source of all groups, individuals and methodologies. And because of that, it, the externalized aspect of it, as it appears into time, can change, can transform. Right. And so it's very much like onto the next one, man. Right. Onto the next one. Clearly, that's the only way to be, right?

Yeah. And here it is now. This is it. Here it is now. Here it is now. Here it is now. Wow. Here's how it is now. Oh, fuck. Here's how it is now. And it gets the, whenever you come back, it's really cool because it's just, there it is. There it is. There she is. There he is. It's just waiting for you. Like, Hey, oh my God, it's you. Hey, I missed you. What's up? Let's, let's hang out. And then you hang out. And it's like, wow, fuck man, you are amazing. And then you forget. And it's, that's the love affair that we're having. That's the love affair. What's the function of the love affair? Or is it just like kind of this dream haze, you know, energetically propelled thing? Dude, think of your last passionate love affair and ask what the, what was the function of that? When you're falling in love, you're like, I don't give a fuck about function. You're not thinking about function. You're just like, let me, I just want to be around you. I want to see you.

I want to smell you. I want to feel you. I want to talk to you. I want to, I want to be with you. Right. You're not really thinking about function. No, of course not. It's, it's, in retrospect, you can look at it and be like, what the fuck was I thinking? What was that? But that's the human version of it. And again, like the manifestation of the divine comes into your life as your lover, as your child, as your art, as your epiphany, you know, it comes in all these different ways. And what is the, I have, I don't know. This thing is wild, man. I don't know. That's a really good fucking answer. I mean, you're like a, you're a true bhakti. You're really, I mean, it seems, it seems like that's the whole premise is that really love is the genesis of this and that this is some big love affair. And that is what's going on. And I don't even think in everything that I've read or experienced, even in specifically the name Corole Bob is thought that there was a function like you're describing it wasn't like this is because of this is just like, grace grew. Remember? People might tell you a function though. I don't know some advanced like people who studied this stuff. They say it's to return back to the ultimate relationship or whatever.

But I don't know, like it's going to, you know, we're talking about the craziest premise, man, but it does follow the same pattern of all love affairs every single every single time that I've fallen in love. The phases of it are go from, I have never seen this person. I've seen the person. I am sitting some time after seeing the person in the person pops into my head. And I think about it, the person for a second, I'm like, Oh, whatever. And then like, suddenly the person pops into my head again. I think, well, I thought about that person again. Huh, I guess I'm thinking about that person now. You know, and then I think I'd like to see that person again. And then you go and hang out with the person and the person's amazing. Right. And you think, Oh, there's no way that this person likes me in the way that I like this person too good for me. Right. I don't deserve this person. Right. And then the person calls you and they're like, wait, what? Oh, shit, they're reaching out to me. Maybe they do like there's no way. And then that's the identical pattern only. In this case, we're talking about the source of every single thing that is in the identical kind of pattern is happening, not over the course of a month, but over the course of infinite lifetimes. You'll spend an entire lifetime waiting for the text.

And it won't come right. Maybe 20 lifetimes with no text coming. You'll spend eons, eons in a complete haze of non remembrance because of perhaps your incarnation isn't the sort of incarnation that could even grasp it. So when we have a human incarnation, and then you're getting the thing and it's happening just a little bit. So in other words, that moment where you're walking down the street and you see a flower and you think about God, whatever that may be for you, that's the love affair. And then the moment when something happens, a synchronicity, an unprecedented synchronicity, falling in love with your wife, having a child. That's, hi, that's God going, hey, I love you. I love you so much. And you think, no, there's no fucking way the source of all matter. There's no way the source of intelligence. No way, no way, no way, no way. I don't deserve it.

And then this is why I love the stories of how Krishna appears because it's like, oh, I'll appear as your baby so that you can experience that level of power. I'll appear as your lover so that you can experience what it's like to have sex with me, to be intimate with me. I'll appear as your death. I'll appear as your birth. I'll be all of these things for you. It's nuts, man. It's a, and it's wild because it just like any great romance, there is no such thing as a domesticated romance. There's no, there's no romantic movie, no romantic book where there's safety involved, where it works out, where it's where one person doesn't in some way temporarily hurt the other. And this love affair with the infinite is so fucking powerful that it kills us over and over and over and over again. That's how crazy this romance is. This thing kills us, man, while simultaneously allowing us to exist forever. This thing is a really, really, really, really, well, it's the source of love. So it's going to be the ultimate lover.

Well, you're also keying in on when you're talking about the birth and the death stuff, that's like the aspect of Kali, right? Which is like, if you look at the picture of Kali, this blue demonic, you know, necklace of like severed heads and stuff, it's like a terrifying thing, but it represents that this is the destruction that has to happen too. Like there's both sides to this. This fits, I guess here's the, here's the idea. You know, may I stop you there for a moment? Of course, of course. So what's really cool about this romance is when you remember it, and you begin to fall in love in this way, then your attachment to the thing that Kali destroys begins to diminish profoundly so that you begin to like, recognize that the body is just a t-shirt or something. You can take it away. So that's how powerful this love affair is, is that should you really become deeply engrossed in it? And for a lot of people in this incarnation, just being happy about the way the sun looks when it comes up or sets is enough.

Some people, they discard every material possession they have, and they shave their head and they begin chanting the names of God and become brahmacharis. It just varies. It just depends. But the more you begin to experience that connection, the more your attachment to the body, it just goes away. In the same way, when you're falling in love, let's imagine that in the midst of playing a fantastic video game fallout, you meet your soulmate at a party or something. Sure. And you start hanging out with your soulmate. You're not going to think about fallout that much. You might a little bit, you can go back to it, it's cool game, whatever, but you're not going to be like, fuck man, I'm going to play fallout every night. Like I've been playing for the last seven months or whatever, because you found something sweeter. Right. So that's what the process is. You find something sweeter and all the other stuff, including your attachment to your life, right? Falls away. That's the trick though, right? Like I, I don't know, I haven't hit the point where the attached, it seems like the very thing that Krishna can appear as all these different aspects of your life. It creates this weird, weird kind of web of attachment in a way too. Like that's what I realized all the time. Like a lot of people, like before I had kids, I thought I had to think about was, do I really want to have a child knowing the chances are that I'm going to die before my child or God forbid my child dies or like just, you know, yes, like he gets sick. It's a new, it's there like when you were describing like, you know, a new relationship or something, there's so many different types of love that like we don't even think about we're thinking like, we know it. Yeah, like there was that love we did.

There's all these different levels and you open yourself up to all of these things. I guess the question is there, how, when you discover that this is going on, when I say the function, I guess I don't mean like the practical, the logic behind it, but it's like when you hear the song in the car and you cry, right? I remember this specifically happened to me like 15 years ago, it's taking a good amount of psychedelics and my immediate thought is, holy shit, this is amazing. Like this is a mystical experience. I'm viscerally feeling this experience. My next thought as I got more familiar with it and really stayed in these states for like days at a time, which was fucking nuts. How do I communicate this to someone else? Everyone should know that this exists. Everyone should be making this the focal point of their lives, to be honest, which I think is a good and noble thought and there's a way to actually do that, but how do we make that kind of, how do we tie that into our lives individually? And that's going to look different for everyone. There's not like, do it like this and that's how it's going to be. For you, it's doing a podcast. It's going to be making music. It should be being playful and putting it out into the world. For everyone, it's going to be something unique. How do we kind of merge these ideas of being in this love affair, you know, this with what is, right? The source of everything and the practicality of being born in the West, you know, we're here. We're not probably going to shave our heads and go to the Himalayas and meditate, you know, for the rest of our lives, potentially, but I don't get the sense that I'm going to do that now. So how do we merge those two kinds of concepts and live life, I guess? That's the question I'm trying to figure out.

Well, the story of Krishna is really cool because he goes and he plays the flute and the forest and everyone just drops everything. They go to God, right? So it's wild. I mean, I don't, I don't fake it. You don't have to. Just keep returning to the love affair and then whatever happens will happen. I think, I mean, that's not a cop out. No, everyone's got so if you, the moment you come up with some methodology for how to deal with a love affair, you kind of love affair is that like a whiteboard. Now that I'm in love, here's how I'll spend my time. This is how I'll talk about it. This is who I'll tell it to. This is who I won't. This is the way that I'll be with the one that I love. I've created something darling. I want to show it to you.

It's my methodology that I'm going to use to interact with you at every single moment. We're talking about a primordial, juicy, organic, erotic romance with a shape-shifting super intelligence that is so passionately in love with us that an entire universe has been created to act as a sort of playground that we can explore these different relationships with this super intelligence and come to understand it more and more and us more and more. Maybe it's understanding itself more and more through us and that's part of it too. It's not one-sided. It's not one-sided. It definitely is. And that's the other thing that I think people really miss is they think, "Okay, you know, because you hear this fundamentalist," and they'll be like, "Once you've given your heart to Jesus Christ, everything's going to be fought forever.

No, maybe not. Maybe it's not going to work out for any of us. Maybe there's an imminent crucial element to it where it isn't going to work out just like a great love affair. This might not work. It might be a failed experiment. It might not work. It might not. The moment you start thinking it's going to work, you get lazy, you take it for granted. This is how it's always going to be. Maybe not. I don't know. It's just that same thing. We've been shown what it is. You know what it is. If you've loved anything at all, you know what it is. You can take that tiny little, whatever it is, whatever it is. You can take a substance and you can just watch forensic files. These freaks, they find a fucking pebble in someone's shoe. And from analyzing that pebble microscopically, they can extrapolate so many things from the study of that pebble in the same way. How much more if you've had any amount of love at all in your life?

From that, you can look as above so below. Because I know what my mother's love for me is or was. Because I know what my love for my dog is. Because I know what my love for beer is. Whenever, wherever there's real love, that's all you need. There's your map. You can begin to look at that and unfold it and understand it. And it's alive. It's a map that talks back. And that will direct you and you'll figure it out from there. Even if it's like a motherfucker. And even if it does like beat you like you're saying, a love affair. I like that analogy a lot because when I think we hear the word love sometimes, like we only get the positive, like cheerful, like, oh, the great feeling. But when you really think about it, when you really are falling in love with someone, you're really opening up yourself to such a degree that the vulnerability there, that's why it feels so good. Because you're you're dropping whatever persona or you go like stuff is going on and saying, no, I love you this much, whatever that word means to each person. And there is that other side of it where this shit can knock you over the head. And that I think is like fundamentally important. And there's this song by Sabado, Lou Barlow, called Healthy Sick. You ever heard that? No, no. But like one of the lines is, it's a healthy kind of sick, a slow sort of quick. I'm very sad. I don't feel bad at all. It's a feeling without a name. No, it's a it's a no slow sort of feeling without a name, a crazy kind of saying, a feeling without a name that they call love. It's a very sweet song. I just fucked it up. But it's a really great song about Bakti. And yeah, that you it's a healthy sick.

You know, you're sick kind of you're sick because the world that you've been trained to interact with as the most important thing is no longer the most important thing. That is, I guess, when I go to the practicality of all this stuff, how do we how do we integrate those things? How do we move through? I remember one of the smartest things I think I've heard was on your podcast with Bruce Damer, who I later came on spoke about this. And he was saying how he like navigates through, you know, like the NASA world and the government agencies. And then you see a picture of him on Facebook and he's like, I'm like a fairy costume like with his shirt off and a flute. And you're like, and he was saying like, you know, it's this ability to melt off these personas and adopt other ones and, you know, incorporate the language and the way that we've spoken to. And I was like, if we can do that and not get attached to either of those, that does give us give us the malleability to bring in that kind of loving presence.

And I think, you know, more than like advice or anything, it is it's the remembrance, right? This is why I still chant the Hanuman, Chilisa, every day is like one of my favorite things about Hanuman is like, he forgot. He was like some super powerful, amazing dude, pretty much like almost all the powers of like every God. He just thought it was some monkey, some like troublemaking monkey, which is just like the perfect fucking metaphor for all of us, right? I mean, it just makes a lot of sense. Dude, thank you for doing this. My pleasure. Thank you. This is great. Yeah. This has been awesome. Thank you, Noah. Cool, dude. Hade Krishna.

♪ I ain't never trimmed that I met somebody like you. I ain't never trimmed that I knew somebody like you. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. ♪ ♪ Make me think of this thing. ♪ ♪ When we're getting to you. ♪ Let me dream of you. No, I'm you. ♪ ♪ Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. ♪ ♪ It's not as time as I'm gonna get you. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. ♪ ♪ Oh, oh, oh, oh. ♪ ♪ It's not as time as I'm gonna get you. Oh, oh, oh, oh. ♪ ♪ See, I feel you. ♪ ♪ Noah doesn't fire now. Can't you save me, buddy? ♪ ♪ It's strange what this I ain't like for you. ♪ ♪ Noah doesn't fire now. Can't you save me, buddy? ♪ ♪ It's what this I ain't like for you. ♪ Oh, man, I really like that cover of Wicked Game, which is why I kind of reworked it a little bit.

You can hear the original on Spotify. Emily Simon, she's French, so I could be saying that name wrong. A really great cover. Excuse me, I just hiccuped in my outro. Duncan, I don't have to say anything else about him. Just a hell of a dude. I've said that I know a lot, but really an inspiration in a lot of ways to many people, including myself. If you want to stay in touch with him, like I said, or tune in to what he's doing, Duncan Trussell Family Hour, one of the best podcasts out there. Again, he's doing live events at the Bell House. He's a creative tour de force. You can catch him twitch live streaming. His Hearthstone playing. We spoke a little bit about Hearthstone.

Do people know what Hearthstone is? It is an online card game developed by Blizzard, and oh my god, it'll suck you into a vortex. They changed the whole system like six months ago, and I haven't gotten back into it, but Duncan is on there strong. Really just tune in to what the man is doing. A shining beacon of light for so many of us. And that's it. And with that, I will see you next week. Oh wait, almost forgot about this. Patrick Nemchik, producer level credit. Thank you for helping get this episode out. And with that, I will see you next week.