Ep. 78 - Cory Allen Also Loves The Great British Bake Off

I've never thought or claimed to have any answers about anything, and I don't go through life thinking I have any answers. I go through life thinking I have ideas based on my experiences. This is synchronicity this is synchronicity this is synchronicity this is synchronicity Welcome to episode 78 of synchronicity my guest this week is Corey Allen this is Corey Corey's second appearance on the show I've gotten a no Corey over the past year I don't even know if it's been a full year yet he is on MindPod network I runs a wonderful podcast called the astral hustle he's a meditation teacher but more importantly he's just cool as fuck he's just like a really cool nice authentic human being and we like those types of people right so I'll get to Corey in just a second that song you heard right there for the intro that's something I started for the beta version of creative evolution which is the creative community and course that is in beta right now it's closed so you can't access it but in May I'm going to be watching the full course and community we have about 20 people when I say about we have 20 people enrolled in the beta version we're working out some of the kinks and we're all probably starting our projects right about now so that song that you heard there will evolve into a completed project over the next four weeks and I'll share it when it's done also as a reminder for people who have been writing in and saying nice things about the music at the before at the before nope it's not how you say that before in the middle and after the show thank you a lot very much serious sincerely thank you you have inspired me to release an EP at the end of the year thinking about four or five songs that I will be releasing so that's pretty that's thanks to you for writing in and saying all those kind of things and for the people who paid that's pretty cool too some people just sent me money and I like your song here you go you're awesome so that's it there's no preamble for anything else that's going on there's there's lots of shit going on in the world we all know that there's lots of stuff going on with our lives but I want to get right to this conversation so this is a between me and Corey so this one is a I think it's a relatively unique episode of synchronicity I would describe this essentially as Corey giving me therapy right I I think when we recorded this one I was going through a particularly overwhelming point of time and this was only recorded like last week but I was just like oh man I got so much shit to do I'm not making a lot of money I don't know what the fuck is going on I hope this works and I was kind of not in a panic state of mind but let's say mildly distraught at the circumstances of my life at that particular moment and it was really nice to be able to talk to Corey and it kind of encapsulates why I love him as a friend a podcaster and just like a cool dude because you'll hear him very deftly kind of swipe away my negative mind states and provide a perspective that isn't really like preachy and he's not telling me what to do and he's not saying I have all the answers and you heard that little beginning clip there but providing some perspective and we all oscillate and Corey oscillates too right he Corey is not an enlightened person yet he would admit as much to anyone so we all need friends and people who help us when we're kind of either questioning what's going on going through a hard time whatever it is and Corey's just excellent at doing that we discuss a ton of stuff in this episode at the least of which is delving into spiritual materialism being authentic meditation right the concept of meditation I had been regularly meditating especially in March and February almost every day and was noticing some clear benefits but I noticed my relationship to meditation is always a little bit wonky like it feels like a task or a chore that I have to do it's not something that I just feel compelled to do on my own and that alters my relationship with it so I like Corey's kind of permission if you will to meditate when you really feel that it's a natural thing to do but also change your perspective and mind potentially about what meditation can be so he says and he says it's corny when he says it but he doesn't really mean that he's saying you know when every breath you take when every aspect of your day is imbued with this mindful quality or this aware quality that's meditation I agree with that so I've been letting go of some of my ideas and concepts of what meditation needs to be and yeah we'll see how that goes but I really I really just I love this episode because it's nice to hear just such a nice and wise human being kind of dish out spiritual truths in a non shitty way that's what we're going for here so check out Corey also I want to say at the beginning they'll be links and it'll be at the end he's an amazing meditation course called release into now so go check that out I believe it's on Aubrey Marcus's site on it but just Google it release into now Corey Allen there are links on his website Corey dash Allen calm check this out and he's made it super affordable they've dropped the price so people can access it if you're interested in meditation you think it's going to have some benefit in your life and you want to hear some perspectives that maybe aren't as top down as some of the other teachers around definitely check it out so without without further ado are we ready to get there I think we're ready to get to the episode without further ado here is the wonderfully wonderfully excellent Corey Allen I would love to hear your perspective about this thing we just did in LA because I feel like I didn't know what to expect and I'm getting people's opinions on just kind of like the general vibe and like what it reveals like what what did you think about that whole thing I thought it was good man I mean I think it's you know bringing people together you know regardless who's on stage and who's in the audience just I think pulling those type of people together who are interested in thoughts interested in ideas and open to public discourse around ideas which don't normally have that type of setting you know in the same way I think that's a really great thing and I think that people are you know interested in that type of thing so it was wonderful to see all these people come out and just join in that whole experience and I had a wonderful time and and yeah it was fantastic yeah man I'm pretty jazz I was I've been trying to you know like D D program from the whole thing and like I was also processing you know going LA for the first time which is just a beautiful what a wonderful weird spread out city I didn't know that a city could function like that but it was fun but yeah the event itself like you know I've gone to you know these rhombos retreats and other kind of like spiritual gatherings that kind of had like a more overt spiritual kind of overtone to them yeah that term makes my skin crawl a little bit spiritual gathering right exactly and you know it that that connotation definitely like influences what's going on but the general vibe of those things and ones I've been to it's there's this weird kind of like communal family thing that seems to form and it could just be my subjective interpretation but I certainly felt like um I'm sure in no small small part aided and abetted by Michael Donovan's microdose that of mushroom this this shit was not a microdose I just want to be clear like I know what a microdose is that was just like a step away from tripping um but there was a very like familial sense from like a lot of the people came out a lot of the the podcasters and like getting to meet everyone for the first time including Janielli it was just like a really really good uh feeling which I'm interested in pursuing and we've talked about replicating them in other places but this sense of bringing people together in person they're really as as big of a fan I am of digital technology and like the ability to work remotely and communicate and like form tribes digitally there really is something to be said for bringing people together in person well of course man you lose 50% of the interaction if you're not in person like think about going to a concert you can watch a you know a concert on your laptop and you're taking it all in but if you're there it's a whole different yeah whole different thing and I think there's that you know and you could you could break it down into whatever type of definition that you like but think about like a comedy show you know I think there's something really to the physical you know however you want to define it the physical feeling of being around other people and that resonance and feedback and then the harmonic like stacking that occurs when of you're around a bunch of people who all have a positive you know and whatever type of mindset that it creates this larger kind of Gestalti you know thing that's happening that you just can't experience via your laptop yeah you know it's like there's that thing of you laugh more in a movie theater right right right right right when you're at home by yourself you laugh more to comedy show than you do when you're listening to something just on your phone or something right the context and the actual vibrations I feel like I you know it's funny is like I've been listening to a lot of different podcast I've been listening to more podcasts than ever before and also just different audio books and I've noticed this very strict aversion to like things that are dubbed woo-woo and I do it myself too but then I also have to reconcile the fact like some of like my core beliefs are just like totally fucking woo-woo like there's no other way to put it you know I consider myself like a grounded you know woo-woo type of person and it's it's interesting because I think even the people who are against kind of whatever those words that have that type of stigma whether it's spiritual whatever a new age whatever it is there is often quite a substantial part of people who are against it who actually do have like some weird belief that they can't actually rationalize away especially if they tend to be somewhat like optimistic and not just like a gloomy son of a bitch I think if like the people who are just like totally rational and have no room for anything like unexplained or mysterious in their life they generally are pretty upset because they got it all figured out and it's like that's a shitty thing to have figured out so right but yeah the scientific materialist view is just as limited in my opinion as the over the deep end woo-woo view right right right and so I've been been tuning into all this and kind of recognizing it and trying to reconcile how to I think it's kind of like a tantric thing right like going into the world being of in the world but not of it right is that the that's yeah that's that's kind of the thing that I guess I'm trying to flesh out because we live in such a like a polarized time where even when we're talking about concepts that aren't like specifically spoken about often in the world how do we approach this because that's what the event was about right that's kind of why I was talking about it's like how do we approach shit that we're all thinking about unexplained things how to be good people how not to be shitheads in a way that doesn't label it spiritual per se but clearly is drawing on traditions that would probably in the past label themselves is spiritual but also fusing it with just where we are in life and that's like one of one of the reasons you're my favorite one of my favorite people is you walk this line I think in a very authentic kind of real way even just based on our conversation yesterday on Facebook where you're talking about like hey you know like when you want to put your stuff out there you know use your thoughts and the thing you say on the podcast because that's ultimately what's going to resonate with people especially if you're trying to sell or pitch anything later on and I was like you know that really just makes a lot of sense and I was saying how I struggle with sometimes being authentic in that type of way and you kind of had to work around right there and lo and behold like I'm seeing some of the stuff you're posting from Facebook and it's just like really really really really well thought out clear direct shit so yeah I got into like an admiration thing in the middle of whatever I was talking about so well well thank you very much I appreciate that that type of stuff that you can see you know the the perspective of my intention within those writings and just my general whole vibe and approach to things and I think that that is the answer to the question that you posed before the moment of admiration was was that you know getting and getting and dealing with some of these more what I would call experimental ideas you know an experimental can be good or bad an experiment could be hey I'm going to you know see if I can hack off my hand with one axe whack you know or will it take many less than five more than 10 I mean that's experimental you know it doesn't mean it's good and then alternatively of course you know in the medical or commuters and something of that nature it could be much more constructive right or what I would deem to be constructive so I think that in these you know in these beliefs especially since they're intangibles that's that's the hardest thing is because you can't see them you can't you know chart them other people they're all just based on our own perception and our own thought process so to me I think that getting into experimental ways of thinking is good because you know if you're going to play in the middle street you know you've got you know you've got it right see what's in your neighbor's lawn see what's across the street but thinking about all of those ways of thinking I think there's a a linear flow of the arising of how you think about things and how you relate and associate with those things so to I look at it like there is the arising of the thought there's the moment of inquiry then there is the you know potential open flexibility of a of an idea and then you know then that moves into the rationalization and contemplation of said idea and I just sort of made that up as I was talking about it but it seems to make sense also make a lot of sense I wonder how many people miss the inquiry part of the ideas or thoughts that because that's something that so like I hadn't you meditate every day no no I only meditate whenever I do public meditation workshops really that's what I tell people okay it's workshops because people always ask yeah yeah how long do you when you meditate I'm like oh the only more I do this I was gonna say like that's nuts um so like I I meditate more now than I have in the past but there's something that note I notice you know and maybe it's uh maybe it's not what I'm drawing the conclusion that it is but when I don't meditate for let's say three or four days after I have been I notice myself getting impatient and angry after the fact instead of during or before the fact so logically you know since I've been doing this for a few years um you know I'm at the point where I am just like okay I get it like I get that this stuff is happening this is the importance this is the relevance it has in my life but I also recognize that however many thoughts I do catch and can be like hey what what's that about you know do I want to grasp onto that there are hundreds if not thousands where I'm either just pushing them away grasping at them or just completely oblivious that they're going on at all and this is why I mean this is you know tying this kind of get out of the podcast stuff this is why I think these these conversations are really important why the live event went well is that's just kind of what we're all going through so when we have an ability to kind of bring it to the surface of consciousness we then have the ability to kind of extend that to different areas and that's something that again like what I like that you're doing is you have a very clear and direct way and I think that's the shining I'm always trying to think about my impod network about like what is the characteristic that the ties all these people together talking about things from different perspectives even entirely different concepts and ideas sometimes and it's this idea of being kind of authentic in their pursuit of what's going on and then being as clear as possible once that investigation is done I think that's something you and embody but it's also something that I think a lot of people just including myself just like miss a lot every day and it's tough right yeah I mean it certainly can be and thank you again I mean to me my soul pursuit is is just truth right and not not truth in the sense of my truth but empirically testable sensible reasonable functional type of approaches to ideas it's like I have no answers you know I've never I've never thought or claimed to have any answers about anything and I don't go through life thinking I had like go through life thinking I have ideas based on my experiences and that's how I actually relate to all philosophies all quote unquote spiritualities or even you know as you're saying about the mind pod network like there's podcasts there are more about art and things like that I approach those things the same way it's just a way of approaching life it's like not getting identifying but through the idea or the system of thinking but realizing that every thing that you're thinking and every way of thinking is simply a system of thinking and not getting lost in any of it and so if you can go to where the river is flowing out of like where the beginning of the thoughts arise kind of the thing I was talking about earlier yes yes if right there right that's where intention is born is in is in the well-spring meal the mouth of the river of the arising of your own consciousness and so that moment I spent a lot of time tracking it back trying to get back there back to back to more of I got down to that spot as far as I could I thought okay this is where intention is born and this is where my mindfulness is born and this is where I can create the biggest amount of internal space between me and you know my response to life and my also my response to my own thinking and so whenever thoughts arise I have that place that moment of presence before the the intellectualization or before the rationalization before that stuff to pause and understand that everything I'm thinking even what I'm thinking now is all just this a gobbledygook of an illusion based on all the beeping and clicking and meat that's pumping in my brain so I understand that yeah it's very burned into me so whenever I go to to you know think about any of these ideas or even contemplate or be open to somebody like you said that was woo woo I will you know I can earnestly think about it on the stage of my mind but at no point is there any worry of me getting seduced or pulled into that way of thinking because it's not possible in the way that my the architecture of my mind is structured also I naturally have a proclivity to uh I really want to crush bullshit I know I don't like and so that that knows I love it man I fucking love it I love it I remember Michael Philip was saying how you were shooting like mental daggers at the alien space cowboy dude and that's that's fucking great is it something I would never do but is obviously like totally called for at some point because it's just like so fucking bullshitty and ridiculous and like you know sometimes it's not always as overt as something like that but it still exists and I think calling it out is really important so like what what were some methods you used to track back to get to like that well-spring of consciousness as you were talking about was it kind of like Ramana Maharshi self inquiry thing like where's this coming from why is this happening like how did you track it back um well I mean you know over the the years I've done so many methods of that yeah I think really to me like meditation was helpful and just trying to like literally watch my thoughts like during my meditation I spent a long period of time just like observing the arising so whenever I began to become aware and self-reflective of my own river of consciousness and my own flow of thoughts that just picture was articulated further and further and further more detail was applied to it and as I then saw like okay I get a sense of how the arising of my thoughts is occurring in my mind it's like it seems like and John Simon and I talk about this a lot is like it seems like it's coming from like I say my brain stem because it seems to be deeper than the brain and so it literally like arises like the fountain and then spreads out to the hemispheres of the mind and then the river flows on from there and then it seems to just sort of like either it's the horizon of my knowing of it becomes shrouded or they're like just releasing into the ether of a reverse or my own thoughts anyway so I would just I spent a long long time meditating and just not trying to do anything but just watching the arising of my thoughts right and as I developed a good skill doing that I started looking backwards and backwards and backwards and backwards that makes a fuckload of sense too I mean I feel like that's happened in moments I fight against meditation so much I don't know why and like I will get into grooves where it just locks but like there's something about getting my mind to not even sit still because I can actually appreciate it for a little bit but building up like I don't want to say it's the belief but the consistency and it's interesting because I was you know I've been doing this creativity course and I've been building up a shitload of consistency in terms of creativity and creative momentum to the point where now it's just like a second nature thing when I wake up every day but the meditation will still like any small like here's what upset my my most recent meditation practice it was going to LA right I was in an unfamiliar environment you know my routine was upset I certainly once the day gets started I've never been the type of person who can just like do it later in the day and it just like it fucked me up and like I started doing it I noticed I hadn't done it for like a week and I was just like a rage machine inside and like someone said something to me to recently that like really resonated which is my initial reaction to most things that are uncomfortable or I don't like is anger right that's like my go-to it's like the first thing and someone pointed out it's like you know there could be a spectrum of other emotions that are going on but you've just kind of like bypassed all of those and made this routine of getting angry at what's going on and in that moment I was like oh shit like that's actually true like I didn't realize I created this little shortcut for myself and like I could be hurt I could be sad I could be scared there could be all these other things going on but my way of dealing with that was you know just getting angry every single time so you know I wonder I know I mean we have a whole fucking product from MindPod Network coming out about you know people who want to stay mindful but don't like meditating a traditional sense like what what do you recommend for people who have difficulty maintaining a meditation practice who maybe are well-versed and actually practicing the benefits potentially the idea behind it and even just what you said like that's that's an incredibly practically useful way of using meditation just tracking back and watching the thoughts arise is an incredibly powerful thing as someone who's done that it's like holy shit you had no idea like what do you recommend to people who are like you know I don't know like I don't know how to do it like what do I do I mean in this applies to like your situation as well is that like meditation is just a state of mind it's the absolute core of it it really is and honestly like we're joking about my own meditation practice so if I go week I go weeks without meditating yeah and because to me and as you know saccharinism I sound like every moment every breath is the meditation to me you know it's like so if you can build that into your way of thinking and also not punishing yourself whenever you forget because we for whatever reason you know people have this this thing built into them I I haven't mentioned to me constantly where they say oh I feel bad because I didn't meditate I'm like what are you talking about right now that's that's that's really um that's not good it's not good it's just not really helpful and it doesn't matter right it's a forward moving pursuit you know and so right whenever you just as much as a person can you know remember to watch the breath and then also keep the shoulders down that keeps your chest move your your chest out a little bit keeps your shoulders from going up to your ears and and getting tense and just the more you can begin to sort of like throughout the day catch going like oh right I'm not breathing you know fully I'm not taking short little breaths I'm not bringing this deeply or I have my shoulders are all super tense and tightened up by my ears I'm gonna just take a breath relax you know the more you can do that the more you'll slowly start evolving into this this kind of remembering because uh so much of it is just self-awareness you know like so when if you're aware of what your mind and your body and your breath are all you know what functionality and what modes that they're in um it's only exponential so it just keeps increasing increasing increasing and before you know it you're always aware of your breath you know it's like just from my own personal experience I mean I started that practice just paying attention to it and whenever I've noticed it it's kind of funny is that it was back in that you know a decade ago I worked in record stores but I would notice my breath being shorter that was holding or something and I would just take a huge exhale just to really push it out because you're you think about the fact that you're in an atmosphere and that the atmosphere of the earth is pressurized and so right you're you're in there so that the pressure and the atmosphere it wants to push air into your lungs because you're this little like this little pocket right in your body yeah vacuum it's a little vacuum right so you're you're stuck in a vacuum and so if you just breathe out all the way then it's gonna go instantly another breath the atmosphere will shove one in there for you so that's a good it can sound like you're sighing which is funny yeah um but you know it's still a good thing to do yeah yeah it's it's a good little reminder good reminder and you know I just want to think about your anger yeah is that they're for sure well firstly I like how open you are about that because I guess a lot of people would either feel embarrassed or vulnerable or ashamed or or just or whatever it might be no shame yeah um I do appreciate that you are open talking about that that's cool you know but man I to me from where I said it looks like just a defense mechanism yeah there's yeah there's a couple of ways to deal with the complex spectrum as you mentioned of of resonance feedback and response emotionally intellectually and so forth to the things that we experience in life and uh I see three major ways that things are dealt with just through my observation again no answers ideas based on experience so observing people in myself in the world I see the first way is to ignore things you know that's one way you oh yeah it didn't act like it didn't happen and move on trying if you get into a confrontation or a challenging situation with another person just sort of like addressing it for a second and then just moving on something else and just putting on the the face of smileiness and that oh everything's fine you know we'll just blah blah blah you can kind of charm yourself and you're the other person into just glossing over it um the the number three which is the the other end of the spectrum is hitting the nuclear explosion button and that is going well look man I understand if you don't if you don't want to talk to me again then that's fine that's again that's the the inverse of the glossing over thing um and that's what I think your your anger is right you know not in a um calculated way but as a what is formed as a synopsis response to things that are overwhelming right I think that's absolutely right yeah that your response that is as opposed to um dealing with it is hitting the nuclear button and that actually that that anger puts you in a place where you're ignoring the problem so it's like number one but it's turned into number three so you're going ah I'm so pissed and then now you're distracted by your anger so the concept of anger now becomes the thing to work with instead of reality um now number two which I think is the the correct or the most useful answer in this is to um take responsibility and to deal with what's happening in the moment right so if you fuck someone over say that say that not that you ever would but say that you fuck somebody over and then you call them up to apologize hey man uh you know how's it going and then you just talk and then you try and have a conversation and see if they'll bite it's the you see if they'll go along with normalcy and then you know okay did I get out of that are they just gonna be cool and not say anything and we can just kind of continue on being friends but I'll always will always quietly silently hate and resent each other internal the rest of our relationship there's that's how a lot of people deal with things yeah number three is this a calling of up and saying uh let's you know if you never want to talk to me again I get it cool by and then that again is not dealing with it but number two is calling up and saying hey I'm sorry I did this I'm a fucking bonehead I didn't mean to do it or I did it and I'm sorry and uh I you know would love to regain your trust again and uh I can just show you through my action how I will move forward not making those type of mistakes and being a better friend right right you know and that that thing is what you need to do with yourself or what would be helped to do with yourself and your own anger you know is whenever there's situations overwhelming like using some of that mindfulness that that even if you can get a finger in you know to the negative space between whenever you're reacting and you know like a fingernail in at this point hey that's enough that's enough man as long as there's something and then you know begin to take responsibility for that moment and that feeling um then it just slowly it's just a tiny crack is all it takes to shatter that that damn you know it's just a little bit of time and a little bit of time a little bit and maybe it's three years from now you know but then eventually that that anger will your your brain will see it as an unnecessary use of energy well it has I mean that's that's certainly happened I can use a ridiculous example of being a Miami Dolphins fan and I can I mean I in the earlier years of like high school and college I was insane and in like public places like not okay and like I rooted for the Dolphins they were terrible they were losing all the time and I was just taking it so hard and over the years I've learned to like I still get upset but now it's like a minute after the game I'm okay um you know the the stickier closer to home stuff obviously are still kind of issues for me but like here's another I have I'm gonna use this as my choreotherapy session we'll just do regular duty so my so this is another thing like I found in my life and I am no I'm not unique in this um you know when things are going well when when everything is flowing and you know in in all aspects of life and and I I'd be lying if I said that that tip that's usually how my life is um it's usually everything is really really good um you know even if things objectively aren't good but like you know I'm able to process it in very good spirits and and work through difficult times but once in a while it's punctuated by these uh areas or transition periods where shit is not good right and I I'm at the tail end of one of these now I'm certainly not in the thick of it as I was maybe like I don't know three to six months ago um but I'm at the tail end of one right now and I also find that my like stabilization of like equanimity and kind of general outlook of knowing of you know being in the world but not of it is really tested in those situations and I know this is this is not just uh relegated to one aspect of someone's life so it's not just like in my case it was a professional thing right professional and financial big big areas and big stressors for a lot of people but it could be you know a death or the ending of a relationship you know these things happen but it really is when these kind of like tools and practices get tested and I definitely find I don't waver like fundamentally like I don't have a dark night of the soul but like it definitely it's like turbulence you know what I mean and I definitely get jostled and freaked out um about turbulence sometimes so and it's just like I wonder what we do in those moments to kind of reassure ourselves and also just know that even if things don't kind of actually work out the way we want them to that everything is gonna be okay because I do believe that you know and uh you know I even think death is gonna be okay so it's just gonna be you know yeah exactly exactly exactly um yeah man I feel like I have a funny story that applies to this so I was watching uh this I'm not really a tv watcher very much but I really like cooking shows and so I was watching this this cooking series where there's like contestants that are they're cooking and a episodic series and each week someone gets eliminated right what was the show is the british baking oh my god it's the best fucking show I read so I thought you're talking about we just finished it I watched it we you know let's just watch it in a month like last in a month beautiful amazing best show yeah and they're all adorable that's why I love it so much they're the nicest sweetest helpingest beautiful people it amazing yeah yeah it's it's wonderful so um you know as what as I was watching that um I was just observing each contestant's narrative yes I was doing this too and I would watch in like one episode you watch these interviews and they're like oh man I really hope that I uh can you know not be eliminated this week I just really would like to get past the first one yeah they do then go on to second third fourth week and people start getting eliminated and you start learning these different people's kind of personalities and then one person you'll see who they look like a front runner and then she messes up and she has something bad and then the interviewer and she's crying and she's saying oh god you know I I think I'm gonna go home this week I'm really terrified and I'm really I'm really worried and then someone else does well and then next week they have the same moment who was crying the previous week and then she got she won the prize she won that week right and so she in her interview now is over the moon with joy and she's just just oh I'm so it's so touching and amazing to be you know you know this week's best baker I had a beautiful beautiful week oh this is magic like star baker yeah the next week comes around and then they mess up again and then they're interviewed again and then they're crying and they're upset and they're like oh god you know I think this is the end of the road for me and then the week after that they're star baker again and they interview them again they're super excited and they're happy oh I can't wait what if I make it to the final so I was watching that in the parallel narratives of all of these people experiencing the exact same thing so you have like 10 people right all going through these ups and downs and in each interview they're like happy one week sad the next week happy you know next week worried next week hopeful the next week so on and so forth right and I was watching that I was like you know I was thinking like it's so funny how like the this is such a great and weird example of how of the middle way in Buddhism it's like the peaks you know of their experience where they're happy are canceling out their negative experiences if they're having the next week or the previous week and their negative experiences are nullifying their positive experiences right in the terms of their own internal narrative right so the takeaway from that is that you know being is happening right and we all experience as a happen sense of our lives a series of positive moments and peaks and a series of negative moments and challenges but neither of those things are things to get lost in because both are equally delusional things right right right and so whenever you're because it's a breathing everything breathes look at the trees the trees are flowing the coral reefs are are breathing the ocean is breathing the cosmos is breathing with the the rotation of all the plants our bodies are breathing everything is contracting expanding contract the thus with the macro is the micro and in our internal worlds in our emotional states and in our general outlooks people we expand we contract we expand and we contract and now just because that we understand that that happens doesn't make the contraction suck any less right however what I how what through my kind of self-reflection what I've actually noticed is I've began to look at those negative moments and those rocky as you said turbulent moments is actually really positive things right because looking at the bigger picture as the viewer of my own narrative like I was watching in that baking show whenever I feel negative I began to sort of just observe my own thought process in that that state and what I realized was that even though it it felt in that moment like it sucked my decision making change because I was feeling the thing that sucked yeah and what that decision making led to ultimately further in time was something way greater right than something I could have anticipated right and so like my own and I wouldn't have thought that way it wouldn't have made that type of decision work I'm not feeling shitty and not feeling you know on a downward swing right you know what I mean and so in not saying that like okay well everything's going to be every negative situation will lead to some some payoff right of course of course not know what I'm saying is that the nuance and kind of what I think that's almost the reason or the necessity for those type of swings is to actually keep a balance but in understanding that that that that balance that middle path is really you know where stability and and peace and what people call and enlightenment or awakening exists in a lot of ways right um you're not grasping you're not grasping or pushing away or being ignorant of what is actually happening I mean it's it's funny because it's so easy to kind of intellectually grasp that that's what's going on even in the midst of it you have these moments or I have these moments of clarity where it's like you know what this seemed like a really and objectively shitty stuff like there's there's no way to to kind of rationalize away some of the things that happen in our lives that they're just like it's not a great thing we can say good and bad we live in a dual universe you know we can we can objectively point out some good and bad things but not getting attached to it and recognizing that there is that potential for growth is super super important I mean it's I guess it's hard as you're getting shaped or you're kind of emerging from a cocoon into a butterfly to use a tried and true metaphor it's kind of hard to to recognize that and be okay with it but I also feel like in another kind of weird way it's like a metaphor for death too right like that's like the ultimate kind of whether it's ego death or just like physical death like that's the ultimate kind of fighting against what is seemingly a very difficult the most difficult situation for the body in the case of physical death but also recognizing that you know it's going to happen it's just the way things work and it doesn't necessarily have to be a bad or good thing because as you point out and like this is ultimately I think what gets me out of these negative mind states when they happen is recognizing like whatever is going on in my mind I fundamentally don't even really believe that I exist like and I and I really say that with the utmost confidence I don't say it's tongue and tongue and cheek like when you get to those places you recognize like this is just a swirling amalgamation of many different things going on this illusion that I call I may be a you know particularly useful vehicle for functioning in this reality but it's not really as consistent or gelled as I like to think it is nevertheless I still freak out when I'm not making as much money as I was six months you know what I mean it's like it's one of these things where you know it's kind of molding and shaping the future version of yourself in like a linear fashion but to kind of like really tap into it and accept it and I feel like this is you know I don't like to call it the universe but I feel like we interact with what's out there in our and outer worlds interact to kind of create the conditions that we have to go through as people you know what I mean and it's just like there's no fucking escaping it you know what I mean like whatever whether you want to call that karma whether you want to call it you know whatever it is just whatever it is there's these situations that we what do you think so let me ask you I think in our first one we did of these I kind of gave you my general conception of how like the world or universe or kind of this metaphysical stuff works like what do you think what the fuck is going on like I think I asked this before but like what do you think is kind of generating some people think it's a simulation some people think it's samsara in a loose real world some people think it's the merging of union and bliss some people think it's just here we are chaos like good fucking luck like what do you what's your kind of general outlook on what this is uh well of course I mean who the fuck now of course of course this is speculation wild speculation I collaborated on a a idea for the birth of the universe during a conversation with Michael Philip which I I enjoy as my favorite explanation for the existence of everything so I'll recap it quickly here so um you know a true artist comes up with a repaint's their own unique picture right so so um there was a god right and not not a Christian god or a Hindu god or anything like that but some god outside of the realm those are those are human things as a human philosophy god outside of the realm of of the constraints of the human imagination existing in omnipotence and infinity and inherently seemingly in the being of all things we want to overcome you know animals do this humans certainly do this yes stars do this they overcome their own existence by not existing so inherently that seems to be a process of the the universe so this god experiencing its own omnipotence was like uh one of us if you were I were in a warehouse that was completely dark and completely empty we're the god of that warehouse but how boring is that warehouse and how long could you stand to be in there so the god contemplated for a long time and the only way that he or she or it could figure out to uh overcome its own omnipotence and its own infinity was to kill itself and so it pulls out a gun and it blew its brains out and as its brains exploded that was the big bang and the pieces of its consciousness spread across the cosmos and the fragments of that created what we understand as a universe who created that god wow that's that's gonna be the next thing we're gonna figure out all right sounds plausible to me and so like i think that is tapping into though this instinctual what you're talking about the the will to overcome i mean it does seem to be the hallmark of everything around us right even internally it seems like oh well internally maybe more of a balancing than an overcoming i feel like it's more of scraping away and peeling away when you're dealing with internal stuff rather than kind of like digging and finding you know what i'm trying to find a metaphor that's not excavating but it's a pushing forward right yeah it's it's it's it's a very it's i'm wondering because the physical universe is like i think it's a like an abstraction right i mean we know we only perceive so much through our senses and even you know for those of us who believe in extra sensory stuff that we don't label as you know one of our five physical senses it's still a best an abstraction of what really is going on we'd be overwhelmed like our eyeballs alone right they flip things upside down we're seeing the world upside down because i don't know we evolved to do that because visually it would have been fucked up if we saw everything yeah they were yeah it's like if you read one of my favorite explanations of that is that like if you read Ezra pontos which is why my dog is St. Mesra because he describes it it's like we you need in order to see the beauty of the you know waves crashing on the shore you need waves you need a shore and you need a pair of human eyes that have evolved to find that beautiful the fish does not find the waves crashing on the shore beautiful you know our eyes and our senses have evolved to find our earth beautiful and that there are things we don't move towards because water is healthy well yeah and for a fish that's a fucking terrifying thing that just like the this is the worst possible place you could be yeah oh man well so what do you think like why do you think we incarnate here as human beings is there a why for that or is it just an is i i think that there there seems to be an in is a general sense of isness i think you know i i typically answer that with it's because incarnation is good man being is good and like Pepe the frog feels good man feels good right yeah and i thought about like um i've been thinking a lot about the origin of of life recently and i was talking to one of my really good friends who is a molecular cell and biology PhD and i was asking him some of these questions that i have been thinking of because you know it's see if you bait kind of break down the existence of everything to its very fundamentals you can see that okay all things are atomic matter so it's all atoms you know jammed together in different combinations to create what we know as the universe right right so the thing that i was curious about and just thinking a lot about was like so why is it why does it seem that like the atoms that create even dna it all seems to be structured to continue to replicate and to be so why is it being because if it wasn't being it wouldn't matter and if there's no it's a kind of the tree in the forest thing if our consciousness if there's no consciousness to be aware of the existence of the all doesn't matter if the all exists at all i mean i would say no but it seems that for some reason this thing the very fiber of what we use together the tapestry of the universe has an urge and it's not even a conscious urge it's just constructed to happen and to continue to exist and to me that what i can extrapolate from that and like where i can find meaning and in use within that is by saying my little pruny monkey brain cannot conceive of what the the reason for that is um and it may not be necessary to understand that however what i can see from thinking about our current uh standing and understanding of how things operate on a scientific level is that it is constructed to be and it is constructed and formulated to continue to happen and to me i look at that as kind of a signal or some type of wink or some type of like not even i think evidence is even too strong of a word um maybe it's a gleam in the eye of everything that i see as like okay being is is good and it needs to be and that's and that's how i sort of i leave it there because there's no possible way at this moment time first actually have an answer right um well no that's that's huge though what you're saying i mean that's that's what i think synchronicity is too i think it's that little cosmic wink where we're not getting an answer but we're getting like a little nudge you know like a little yeah yeah yeah and i'm gonna hear your voice making that sound makes that my experience it's embedded there now i also have another a lot of thoughts about synchronicity as far as like um i wonder if it's if synchronicity you know the of course there's all the classic definitions but i also wonder if it's just like in the generation of our earth and like the conduits of our brain and able to compartmentalize and like not compartmentalize in the sense of emotionally but like understand and chart ideas and loops and patterns is there just a finite amount of like there's an end to variation within loops patterns and like even human genetics so you know you i'm sure you've met a friend that you uh you've known for years and then you fly to LA and then there's some other guy that looks just right right i thought about this like it was the same laugh and you're like what yes and you know i i've had that experience too and it's really bizarre and i just think like the just the the potential for of the ceiling of human genetic possibility is only so high and it only needs so much variance like on an actual biological level like it it needs variance but just it doesn't need to be like infinite it just needs a lot well and so yeah and it makes me wonder if synchronicity is is actually us grab having a momentary sense of awareness where we see just kind of the edge of the necessity for the complexity of all things yeah i mean well carl young famously said you know synchronicity is an ever-present reality for those who have eyes to see which much more eloquently put in you know the thoughts i was having which is like when i was note i you know i lived in a state of mind where i've spoken about it before i don't know how in depth but you know every took some LSD for like three to four months you know every everything was one giant synchronicity and i mean that in the most specific and literal terms i could ever i mean it was just like the flow state jacked up to 11 like it was really just like an insane experience which really you know psychologically was a lot for like a 20 year old grown human adult to process but like looking back was a very profound and like ultimately taught me a lot about kind of the nature of reality and when you're talking about you know seeing people who look the same right i i have experienced that in multiple ways one is where you just genetically see like this person really looks like someone three ways actually the second ways where you experience that but you also get the sense that there's something else being communicated in that moment that that is kind of like a archetype of the friend you know who looks like that and it's not just the physical similarities but some other thing and then the third experience or a third way to approach it which i had on LSD once i was in boston um in college and i was at my friend's dorm um and there was this girl and we were we were definitely attracted to each other and there was kind of something happened then i took some LSD and you know she i went away did something for a little bit came back and she was in the doorway and what happened in that moment when i was looking at her i saw her turn into every female who i had ever had any significant relationship whether sexual intimate familial all morphing in to the same person over and over again like you know going through my mom going through my sister going through my first girlfriend going through a crush going through this girl and it was like you know obviously at that point it was over i could not do anything with this girl but like i was witnessing to me at the time of an overwhelming experience but what it felt like looking back is this was kind of like the feminine female archetype manifesting visually from my unconscious on to a person which also kind of points to the fact that this that that may be how reality actually is more than we're actually seeing it and filtering it down that may be how our mind so those neurotransmitters got hooked up there and like i was actually seeing a little bit more clearly um than what we actually process and kind of filter through so i mean synchronicity functions into all of those situations it's also just the term that is really purposefully nebulous i mean karl Jung was the one who popularized it i mean his definition is very obtuse it's you know an a causal pattern of orderedness what the fuck karl like what are you doing what is what is that it makes a lot of sense to me yeah it's like if you and i think this kind of points to what you were experiencing whether you were on lsd um is that you at well the veil was removed from your own uh static sense of perception and consciousness and how you relate to your own perception right the veil was moved so that you became your perception became modular then at the same time you're able to see chaos which is the universe uh in a in a sense of it's happening right it's or the sense of the atomic level i was talking about it is chaos right and then you also as you recognize that you also recognize that chaos is perfect order it's but it's the inverse of what humans normally see as order because it's spontaneous order right right right well so spontaneous or this is something that's a very interesting topic for me spontaneity or extemporaneous stuff that's where i think that's why i like podcasts so much right and that's why at the beginning of this one we're like we don't need to really pick anything and sometimes people ask like what topics do you want to talk about what do you want to discuss but when you think about your relationships with people you don't go into every react interaction being like we're gonna just cause this we're gonna just suck the news is it and out of those spontaneous kind of alchemical situations and dynamics that's like where the real shit happens right that's like provide that's like the the breeding ground for synchronicity and other experiences like that which to me is kind of a paradigm that's emerging um you know aided and embedded obviously by technology and and kind of being able to create these beacons and conversations like this but it's a fascinating fascinating thing to witness that i don't know how many people are actually actually consciously witnessing and kind of appreciating because um we do it as people naturally like that's just how we function socially but for some reason when we go out into the world whether we're putting on our own ego masks or identities or personas or personalities it's something that is this is when people talk about like your inner child you know like this is this is another quality that i will say that i really like about people on mind pod network is we're kind of all still kids you know what i mean like we haven't lost that desire and joy and like you know curiosity to understand and explore relationships and people in the world at large and like you know culturally that's that's typically beaten out of people even if they reserve some part of themselves and they maybe like get it out through fantasy or movies or whatever but um you know i i think that that is an important thing to maintain like i always joke you know i figured out there was no adults in like middle school i was like no it's an adult this is a bullshit concept that doesn't mean anything like i know this for a fact which is why i never consider myself adult even though my poor little son is gonna find that out soon enough yeah it's so funny you say that speaking of synchronicity because yeah the fact that you know me and generally just my friends and life all have not decided on a fixed system of thinking and that's why i like those people that's why i like you and that's why like you know most of the people on the mind pub are not joking that's why everybody on the mind pod. Leave out Michael Donovan yeah um yeah so you know the experience i actually this morning uh one of us taking Ezra to doggy daycare uh was i saw this this older fellow walking across the street and he was probably i don't know about 60 he looked really really like that just kind of like brisket that's been cooked to a crisp type of like old old timer body with like deep lines in his face a white Yosemite Sam mustache that was like that chopped real tough rigid mustache and i saw him and i thought man that's a there's a hard person that guy looks hard you know in not in the sense of of challenging but i mean like yeah uh World War II type of hardness that that uh industrial revolution america type of grisled steel yeah and then i noticed that he was wearing a name tag and i saw that he was walking to some job like at a grocery store or something and i looked at the expression on his face a little bit more deeply and i saw that you know what i read and of course this could very obviously be a projection of my mind but what i gathered in that moment was that he he just seemed conflicted and he seemed kind of deflated but he still seemed hard and i thought you know what's crazy is that i think that that old man who i was observing as it this tough like got it not not not got it together but just resilient unfazeable guy was well actually probably walking to this job like at a grocery store or something where he was thinking like uh gotta go like i'm still she gotta go work this stupid job i hate this and still feeling uncomfortable still feeling unsure about himself still feeling you know like he hasn't like made it to that place where you know there's the promised idealized like uh sea level buoyancy point that everyone seems to believe in for some reason i mean it's it's hard to understand what everyone is going through at any given moment and what's going on but one thing that i have learned which i never i'm not a Freudian person i thought Freud was pretty fucked up and did a lot of disservice to the world at large but i definitely am tapping more into this idea of our psychology that's formed when we're kids with our relationship to you know our parents the world our siblings whatever really just sticks with us man like and i'm seeing it now with my kid and he sees it's not even a year yet he's almost 11 months but like the way that babies and children process things is fucking insane and that stuff if you believe in any of this you know metaphysical psychological tracing back stuff that stuff is there and i think people carrying it around and this isn't like free your inner child woo woo therapy session but i think getting in touch with kind of the deeper aspects of what you want to do in life that's why i'm doing the creativity project i realized that helps a lot of people including myself work out some of this shit in a way that's a little more abstract than being like okay i'm going to do this i'm going to figure out who i am this is the person i am this is me now which is what a lot of people do that's how they shape their world their identity and how they kind of navigate but instead just taking some kind of creative passion or pursuit codifying it in a way that you actually focus on it over a period of time and seeing what emerges which ultimately i think that's just kind of what life is right even if we're using all of these abstractions and ideas and whatever like that's really all any of us are doing sometimes we play in the playground that kind of culture sets up and says well this is how you do it and then there are those of us who are just like no i don't want to play in that sand box sand box maybe i'll come in once in a while but there's some other cool shit over there there's a whole ocean or something so it's just interesting to me to see how people kind of make sense of the world around them and also again like you pointed out how they form meaning and then also just as important to that how they function in the world like what what are their tenets what are their beliefs and what people say typically i don't put a tremendous amount of stock in i've learned that both in pleasant and unpleasant ways but really how they are like what what's being communicated even when they're not saying anything and that again tying it back to the beginning of this conversation with the the la event like that's what was so fucking awesome to me every single person who is there who you know we invited from the network like they were communicating everything that i i had heard over the phone over skype over emails over everything like no one was there's no bullshit there right that's why it was such a pleasant environment and then hearing how michael was talking about that contrasted with the the place that you had been you know a couple weeks earlier like and i've seen that shit everywhere too i've seen that in you know some legitimate organizations that stuff is inescapable but you know i think as long as we kind of uncover and pull and call it the bullshit you know it's easier to function too so no oh sure and and also i think an important aspect of that process is then not falling into the worst trap then the spiritual materialist but the person who is now the bullshit assassin because that identity is even grosser yeah but i i think to me you know the the real the best way to to um crush bullshit is to simply uh you know treat like a dog just ignore it you know you have a rich spoiled kid poking at you saying dad dad dad dad that you know they'll they'll only do that because in if it gets a response right and so whenever someone brings some of that stuff to me i literally just look right past it and talk to the person that's that's in there and if they can get and feel that and they can have a conversation and cool if not then uh i won't acknowledge or join into the the building and construction and uh and uh furthering of said bullshit yeah that's uh that's an important thing to do is not just feed it and i think i've learned as my life has gone on to do that lesson less i am typically i think i'm a little too accommodating another another blatant flaw in some of my psychology but um yeah man uh i i think we can wrap is there anything that you wanted to talk about that we did and i used you as like my personal therapy session for at least half of this so that's been my pretty much most of my life for some reason so i'm just because you got your shit together man that's what it is like and i and i know you probably don't feel like that all the time but i bet most of the time i mean because you know even in the conversation we had with michael the last one where i think it was a very beautiful kind of metaphor where you had taken the leap off the cliff had landed successfully and i'm like hey it's fine i had just been pushed off and was like what the fuck and michael was like i don't know if i should go like there's that there is some clear there is something being communicated by your presence even do you even remotely that like it's a beacon for people and i think a lot people need more of that than ever before and there's also like a genuineness i know this is like another admiration rant for me but like there's a genuineness with you that like is is a lot of people who can help people by their words or giving perspective that goes to their head really quickly i've seen it i've worked with these people i've i've seen it over and over again and it's natural and i don't even fault people when it happens so much because it's just like a natural tendency right it's like a celebrity who starts buying into the concept that they're actually better than other people it's like i get it i get how that happens it's not true but i get it but you know again um it's why i ask you questions like this i rarely ask people questions um let alone people close to my age because i like to think that i know everything and i'm smart but i really i really do just might be something to look at yeah just just a little bit what do you think um no but i i really do um i just do respect and kind of admire your perspective on things and it's encouraging for those of us who are kind of on this path seeing someone like you who's who's doing really well and is also just like a very nice person because i think at various points um in people's lives like there are points where the people who are not nice people in every life for everyone they're doing well too and the key is just like an any thought that we're talking about in meditation is to not get too fixated on the people who are shitheads who are doing well and also not to get too fixated on the people who are only you know you think are amazing who are doing well but just to keep kind of pushing forward and doing the thing that's authentic for you um and that's what you were saying which is why i like you so well i mean thank you so much man i really appreciate all of those those warm vibrations that you pushed through your microphone through the internet and then out of my headphones into my ears um yeah man i mean i i just that's a reason there's a reason why i waited you know i there was years where people were hitting me up telling me to do all this stuff i'm doing publicly uh then and i i just kept being patient because i continued the work on you know myself and just being completely honest with myself and i waited until i was at a place where i knew that no matter what i interacted with positive or negative that it would not falter me uh my my core um there's a there's a trust that i have with my own mind and with my own intention that is unbreakable and that's what i put out into the world and fortunately that trust happens to uh be in the interest of uh in the most earnest and honest way possible doing what i can to reduce suffering right and increase people's self-awareness you know that that's the whole game to me that's why we're friends yeah yeah man that's the whole game and and you know the amount of like social media love and compliments and emails and all that stuff i get on a daily basis i appreciate them but i don't um you know they they don't uh i don't use that as fuel whatsoever right i appreciate that i see people are benefiting from like something i might be saying but in no way does that make me change how i feel about myself and someone asked me recently how they sent me like a private message on facebook and they were like hey man uh how do you uh do this what without you know aren't you worried that someone's gonna like uh basically troll or whatever and uh like no because that wouldn't affect me anymore or less than the positive stuff right right it's all the same to me you know right and whenever i see a troll i just say oh well they're sharing what where they're hurting in a different right right you know this one person's like oh man that thing really helped me with this this and this and then this other person is like oh you miserable fuck you i'm like oh yeah they're just communicating the same thing their same vulnerability um but it's it's all it's all beautiful man and and it's it's an honor to be of of service and a real pleasure and joy to you know anything i can do uh to you know help you know you or anyone i know or people who listen to um basically just i just share my experiences and and that's that's all you can do right i mean i will say now now having said all of this i have a funny oh well as as one other side thought there is a there really is a feeling and you touched on this man it's a good observation that feeling that you feel with people either you know in conversation or especially in person of course man you can you can just feel people's intention you know no matter what the words that people are putting together um you can feel what somebody's like soul spirit being energy frequency vibration whatever you want to call it is right and i think that's an important thing to not only pay attention to others but to pay attention to your own yeah and to realize how you feel and what you're doing and and how you are putting going out into the world and how you're treating others and yourself and what your real intentions are i think that's a really powerful way to grow and become as you said you know in pursuit of authenticity to become authentic um so the funny thing is is that so uh as i was in LA uh some dear friends of mine uh Lauren and my friend brian ramish who's been on the astral hustle a couple times they were there and i don't get to see them too often so after your guys talk um we left uh to go uh to i was staying at the standard hotel downtown and they have a nice rooftop bar you know what they're having a drink just chilling out a little bit and it'd been i guess an hour since since our our podcast was was done yeah so we're sitting there and i looked at my phone i saw on facebook that uh you know the live stream had been shared and it already been watched like 12 000 times or something like that yeah and so as i was looking at that um my friend Lauren was like oh uh that's that's really cool like 12 000 already views it's like like two hours and i was like yeah you know whatever that's fine i mean that's there i'm like there were people who observed the thing cool you know what's next essentially it's like it doesn't really matter it's nice that that people wash it um but it just is it just is and so she's like oh well you know you should maybe i get that but also another way to look at that is like it's good that people are watching because then you'll be able to continue what you're doing i was like i see i see what you mean for sure but i just don't really i have a judo approach to all of that stuff good and bad i just continue following my nose and doing what i'm doing that's what's important so a couple hours later at dinner michael phillip was texting me and he was like man there's this guy that came up to me at the event at the mine wave event he was saying that the only reason he came was to talk to you and to talk to me and uh that he really wanted to talk to you but that like you know he was nervous or whatever and then you left and so i was like oh well that sucks uh so we were sitting at this table uh having dinner and so i got this receipt you know that it came in the little the little card thing where you pay right and the tray and i wrote hey man thanks for coming on it and i took a selfie with me in that thing and i said hey show this to to my text it to michael and i said go show it to the guy he's still there so he knows that you know i appreciate it um but the point of that is other than just being funny as as i was sharing with the table uh i was like oh hey this is really this is so cool this guy came out you know he said he just came to see michael and i was like no no it doesn't matter yeah that one had me like crying laughing um and then to add to that was that i put that receipt that i wrote hey man thanks for coming with an exclamation mark i went ahead and made sure to put that in the tray with my you know credit card receipt that i signed so that the waiter could find that later and be very very confused something a weird message to receive very weird thanks for coming with though for coming to work thanks for coming to the los angeles like thanks for coming over to the table what i was gonna have all these existential questions thanks for coming into the universe what yeah yeah hopefully that setting off on a tangent of self-interest oh man awesome all right well i i want to is released into now still going on and we can get it yeah yeah it's uh licensed by on it now so uh if you go to release into now.com or the on it home page to see my my mug on there click on any of those links and uh yeah you can go and and since it was uh i partnered on it so that we could really just drop the price down to almost nothing so now the basic course the online six-week module is $47 for six weeks at six hours of meditations with binaural beats and um six weeks of mindfulness talks by me talking about a lot of the you know philosophy and ideas and concepts that you and i have talked about your trip today i know and i'll have links to everything on this page and i'm going to make sure people go to it because the more people who are listening to your melodious voice i think the better i think the better will be that's now i think every conversation we've had i've pointed out how sonorous your voice is whether in person or remotely and i will continue to do so dude thanks thanks for doing this man my absolute pleasure and i'm i'm really immune to that because for whatever reason every single person everyone i talk to says it at some point um and uh it just you know that you got the mysticism of sounding music there's a whole point in the book where he talks about why the voice some people's voices there's a whole point in it um we know i think to be a good philosopher which uh you know that's hopefully i'll be that someday is i think you need a good beard and a good voice well the beard is coming for me and i'm i've slowly accepted my voice i think we're forming a philosophy school i think what mind-pot network is going to be at some point is just like a new technological mystery school and people can go at their own pace whenever they want so that's the idea and you got a good voice man deep in resonance it's not just that's not the only form of good there's a spectrum there's a spectrum i'm just the the very white of the sonic undertow that's all harmony man uh cool dude thank you so much well we'll speak soon too thank you all right peace buddy!

you you you you you you you thank you for listening past the music to that episode as a reminder if you'd like to support this podcast there are a few ways you can do that one is by not paying any money at all leaving a review or rating the podcast on itunes that's super helpful another way is you can donate sinkpodcast.com go check it out there's a donate button and then a few other ways we got a facebook community that's riproar and good times there seriously it's very fun uh i have an email community which is yeah i send you emails but they're about cool stuff and things you might like like the creative course creative evolution uh and then finally uh just you know by listening by doing what you're doing right now is super helpful tell a friend if you think they would like it also be sure to check out mindpodnetwork.com we're adding a bunch of podcasters in the coming weeks uh let me say one since you guys have listened all the way past the end we are adding danielle bolele's wonderful drunken dallas some mind pod network so that's going to be happening over the next couple of weeks uh lots of stuff going on there stay tuned for some news about some events coming on in new york city in the next few months hopefully i will have more information as things solidify and materialize that's it for this week thank you for listening and i'll see you next week hey there it's wayfare here where delivery and setup are as easy as a few taps on your phone you're relaxing in an old hammock scrolling wayfare's app when you spot it a brand new patio set next thing you know wayfare delivers it right to your patio and sets it up oh you need a new grill too all right wayfare's got you covered with wayfare's room of choice delivery and fast expert setup on qualifying orders life gets a little easier visit wayfare.com or the Wayfair app.

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