Ep. 25 - Biet Simkin

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity.

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity.

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity.

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity.

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity.

This is synchronicity. - This is synchronicity. (upbeat music)

Welcome to episode 25 of Synchronicity. My guest today is Biet Simkin, who is a meditation teacher, musician. Musician, no, musician. And what I like to call it, all around creatrics. She's also based at NYC. I'm gonna get to Biet, don't worry. The whole episode is about Biet. I wanted to catch up. Let's first things first. Let's get through the book stuff. Congratulations to Jeremy, who won a copy of Oliver Berkman's The Antidote. On the way, Jeremy. Actually, no Jeremy. He's been a longtime supporter of MindPod Network. He helped get our original T-shirts up and out. Really cool, dude. As far as I know, you're still working at Blizzard, Jeremy.

Keep up the awesome work there. I've been playing the new StarCraft. Fun times. So this week's book giveaway is going to be Rudolph Steiners, the philosophy of freedom. You may have heard me mention Steiner a few times. I just recently got into Rudolph Steiner, a 20th century mystic, all around genius, founded Waldorf schools, biodynamic farming. Just, I had always heard his name, but when the time is right, you find the right things. And I found him and I am loving everything he's doing. So once again, if you're listening to this and you don't know how to enter these book giveaways, all you do is go to syncpodcast.

S-Y-N-C, podcast.com, there's gonna be stuff. It's gonna be clear, join the synchronicity community. Put in your email, give me a name, just your first name. You don't even have to give me your name if you don't want. Maybe that would be nice if I knew your name. And then you're entered automatically, random drawing every single week. There's been, what, seven, eight people who have gotten books already. And I hope you're enjoying them, guys, if you're listening. So yeah, that's all you do. Okay, anything else, anything else? No, let's talk about yet. So I actually got tuned in to be yet because there's a festival going on in Las Vegas from April 29th to May 1st called Further Future.

And this is something that has come about from a collective called Robot Heart who have put on some of my favorite events all around the country, all around the world. World, I don't know, around the country at least, which are these amazing, the Robot Heart parties at least, amazing underground electronic music. Just the vibe of these places is not only great music, but great people. Like the love is palpable. Heart, Robot Heart, it's a real thing. I've been a huge electronic music fan. I'm sure as you can tell from the music I put in and I make primarily, I'm a huge electronic music fan. I got into it in the late '90s, started going to raves and warehouse parties in the DC metropolitan area, buzz.

Does anyone remember the buzz parties in the DC area? Oh my God, some of the best parties. But I, and this is before, I wasn't doing drugs at these things. I know a lot of people think, it's all about the drugs, you go and you're gonna take ecstasy, you're gonna take Molly, you're gonna take MDMA, whatever it is. I just, there's something about electronic music that just speaks to me. Maybe it's the four four beat. Maybe it's the pulse of what's going on. It feels like a heartbeat, but it connects. I connect it, resonates with me very much. So how does this connect with Biet? So I reached out to the further future people.

I didn't know them. I said, I listen, I love your robot heart parties. This further future festival looks amazing. There's, listen, listen, bear with me if you don't know any of these names. But for those of you who do follow electronic music, listen to the names, some of just the musical acts they have performing in further future. Dixon, Lee Burridge, Caribou, Fortet, Leftfield, Derek Carter, Voices from the Lake, Who Made Who? I mean, come on, like this is an insane, just if this was just a music festival, it would be amazing. But further future is more than a music festival, which is how we get to Biet.

Although she is a musician, she is also a meditation teacher. So further future, the idea, as I understand it, and I have not been, and I would be going, let me put this caveat on. I would 100% be there, if not for the fact that I was having a baby, or I should be having a baby, literally the time and this is taking place. So that's my excuse for not going. You guys, if you can make it there, oh my God, you'll have an amazing time. But the festival also includes things like Eric Schmidt, right, Alphabet, Google. There's visionary speakers there. This isn't something just for to have some, you know, fun, pleasurable experience, and that's it.

It's really meant to kind of further the future, right, to bring together fields like consciousness, gastronomy, meditation, music, all of these things, allowing them to kind of coalesce around this event. And I'm sure there'll be many other events like this, and this event specifically that will continue to go on. But to me, it's really cool. It's kind of this merging or coalescence of lots of things that I care about in this outside thing that I didn't put together. So it's amazing. So I reached out to further future people, right? And Jordan, thank you, Jordan, for connecting me and Biet. He was like, listen, I have this person, Biet, who I think is perfect for your show.

I was like, okay, cool, let's get in touch. So we set it up, recorded, I think it was last week, and had an amazing conversation with Biet. She is a fascinating, creative, and all around just lovely person. We talk about a lot of different things in this episode. Her upbringing, her tragic upbringing, which she calls a blessing, which I love, right? Transcending the suffering aspect, and having it be something positive, I think is really one of the most important alchemies we can do in life, and she has clearly done that. We talk about her father, Gregori Simkin, who was a Russian shaman in communist Russia.

I'm sure you can imagine not a lot of shamans in communist Russia. He had to practice yoga in the woods and learn all these Ayurvedic things, and just sounds like a fascinating guy. And Biet, obviously, is better off for having had him as a father and just someone she could connect with on a spiritual level, very, very cool. We also talk about depression and addiction, and how those things exist, and we can't forget about them, but also how to transcend and overcome those things. We also talk about being a musician, and like I said, you'll hear me. Let me take a second to be a little self-conscious.

I listened back to some of these episodes, and something I picked up on is I point out that I go to Berkeley College of Music a lot. So let me explain, I think, let me do a little psychoanalysis on myself, right? Indulge me. I think it's because I went to a music school, as you know, and I really love making music, and it's something I continue to do, but I haven't made a career out of it, right? And there's something I am always, I don't, envious isn't the right word, but I really respect people who pursue their creative passions full bore. You'll hear me saying this episode, I kind of hedge my bets, and I do.

I work in business, I do web stuff, and it pays the bills, and it allows me to support my family, and have a kid, and all these other things, but there's also that part of me that kind of just wants to be a musician, and do that. And you know what, truthfully, I have plans to do that at some point in my life, but it's inspiring to see someone actualizing. You'll hear BTS music, it's at the end of this episode, and it's awesome, it's objectively amazing. So, I love hearing her story, how she was signed to Sony at a young age, really fell into some dark places and dark times. We talk specifically about cocaine and drug use, and the negative ramifications of it, and then how ultimately she transcended it, but I like how music is kind of weaved into her story as well.

I love that. So sorry for digressing there, but I listened to it, and I always say I'm from Berkeley, and I think it's just like a validation thing for myself. I want to remind myself as much as anyone else that I'm still making music, and then I still want to pursue it. So the more I put it out there, the more I feel like I can actualize it. So thank you for bearing with me on that. She also brings up a concept that I love, love, love, love, which is surrendering, suffering. And that's a tricky one, right? Surrender alone, I think, is a difficult kind of concept in the West. It sounds like a weak thing, like you're giving up, but it's not.

Surrendering is actually a very difficult and courageous decision to make when you're able to make it, whether it's surrendering something negative, perceived as suffering, or just saying, okay, this is the way it is. I can't change the situation, or having it even be a component of faith. Like I'm surrendering myself to something I don't understand. These are very transformative states of minds, and she goes into it a little bit, which I thought was awesome. She also talks about radical joy. That's another great concept, because I think it's something that's lost in our society quite a bit. It is almost kind of like a radical thing to be joyful, especially with we can objectively look around and say, well, there's a lot of shitty stuff going on.

And it's not, again, something I've spoken about, this kind of naive, well, everything is great. Everything is great. Everything is light and love. What do you mean something's bad? No, it's not that. It's saying, in the face of everything that I see, that is not great, or is dark, or is shadow, I'm still gonna choose to be joyful in a way that acknowledges it, but also kind of transmutes it, or allows it to manifest its true essence, which I do believe is love. So yeah, oh, I'd be remiss if I didn't point out. The music you'll hear at the end of this episode, I say all the music you hear on synchronicity is mine.

That comes with a caveat that the last thing you'll hear on this episode is from yet's most recent album called "The Lunar." And you will, the song is called "C-Do-Him." You'll see all of the links to this stuff on the podcast page. Do you still not know how to get to the podcast page? You go to syncpodcast, syncpodcast.com. It'll be the first thing you see. Or you can go to minepodnetwork.com/noaa, and you will also see it there. And it'll also probably be on the front page if you're listening to this within a week of this coming out. Do I have anything else? I really, again, I was alluding to this last week.

I had Listen or Caleb tell me that I always am so effusive in saying this is one of my favorite conversations for every single podcast. Well, I'm doing it again. This was one of my favorite conversations. I really enjoyed it. I was really happy to speak to be it. I think you'll hear it in her voice and the dynamic of the conversation that she's just a very genuine and authentic person who's kind of actualizing. She's manifesting destiny, right? And I think that's a real thing, and I think she's doing it. And I truly wish her continued success. I'm looking forward to attending one of her classes up in New York City.

She also wanted me to point out, I'll hear this at the end of the episode. She does private sessions too. If you're in New York, I think this would be someone worth checking out for sure. Especially if you're maybe new to something like meditation, she's got a very cool way of presenting it, which is I think a little more accessible for people who maybe aren't going full bore on a specific path, like a Vajrayana path or a Bhakti path, something a little more present and real for Westerners. So yeah, that's it. Anything else, anything else, I'm thinking, I'm thinking, I'm thinking, no, nothing else.

So without further ado, here is Viet Simkin. (upbeat music)

It's so nice to meet you though, thank you.

Very nice to meet you. Yeah, I'm really excited that Jordan connected us. I reached out to the robot heart crew, you know, in regards to the further future thing, and I'm really happy he connected us. I was doing some cursory research on you, and it seems like I think we're gonna have a really good conversation here, so.

Oh, yay, thank you.

Yeah, so I guess we'll just start it. Thank you so much for coming on too, I really do appreciate it.

Oh, thanks for having me, it's your honor.

Yeah, yeah, where New York are you?

I live in Williamsburg, but I'm, yeah, born and raised in New York City.

Oh, very cool, yeah, I lived in Manhattan, East Village from '08 to June of last year, and I miss it, where we moved to Maryland, Silver Spring, Maryland, right outside of DC. We're having our first son, our first kid, me and my wife in Maine, so.

Oh, oh.

Yeah, we're like, maybe we'll have the kid here, then our plan is to move back to the Hudson Valley area and next year, 'cause we just didn't.

Very cool, yeah.

So again, thank you for coming on. I would love to hear, I know you're a meditation teacher, I know some of your back story, but I'd love to hear kind of in your own words, your relationship to meditation, spirituality, a little bit about your journey, I know that's kind of like an open-ended, broad question, but in your own words, I'd love to get a sense of kind of who you are and what you're doing.

Okay, let's see. So I was born into like a very eccentric family, try to imagine like merging the royal tenon balms with like Mr. Miyagi or something like that.

That's awesome.

Basically, that's like literally not even, not an exaggeration at all. I remember there was this story that my brother said, he said they were immigrating from Russia and they were all at the airport and there was this woman, Mida, who she was like, she was like an aunt growing up but she wasn't related to us by blood at all and she was like a much more normal person. She believed in like things like making money and like fitting in the world.

That's crazy ideas, yeah.

Crazy, just like lucky. And she was actually watching my crazy, eccentric royal tenon balms looking family like, you know, get together in the airport to like leave the country forever. This was in '79, like during the wave when the Jews were like allowed out.

Yeah.

And she looked over at us and she was like, God bless those people. You know, she was like, they are just so different. You know, they're just so not like everyone else. I mean, and this was a woman who ended up becoming like a client of my father's for until he passed away. Which was eight years ago. But he was a shaman psychotherapist. And so, you know, she loved him and loved us but she was just like, wow, these are such weird people. So anyway, she was like, God bless these people. 'Cause they are in some in person trouble with reality.

So yeah, so at from an early age, like I was kind of brought up to always examine the existential side of life and I was really blessed with a really tragic childhood. Like everything that could have gone wrong, went wrong. Like we came to the States and everyone died one by one, including my mom. And I feel like by the time I was like 13, like everyone but my brother and father had died. And then my father raised me. And we just sat at the kitchen table together. Like we didn't have a lot of money 'cause he was the only income source and he was literally enlightened and like this weird vodka drinking saxophone playing shaman.

Wow, wow, wow, wow.

Yeah, and so like my real resource in life was like this endless stream of love and philosophy. We would just sit at the table and we studied books together and then we would discuss them and we would sit at the kitchen and gaze into each other's eyes for hours at a time to like go to celestial planes together. And so that's how I was raised. I'm meditating from birth and yeah.

That is, I loved that you refer to it as being blessed with the tragedy because this is an emerging theme, not only on this podcast but I think just, I've come to realize that it is really a blessing when you encounter suffering and tragedy because those are the moments and opportunities where you really can grow and find out a lot about yourself in the world, the reality, the mystery.

Yes.

Your dad, let's talk about your dad a little bit. It's cool, I grew up playing saxophone. I actually went to Berkeley College of Music to play saxophone and then switched to electronic music but I didn't know he played saxophone. Can you talk a little bit about your father and how he kind of got on the shamanic path? It was in Russia, right? And I remember reading something just in some research that I don't think in communist Russia, shamanism was widely accepted or can go.

No, I'm sure that was an interesting thing but I'd love to hear more about your dad since he's kind of like your root teacher it seems like.

Yeah, he was my root teacher. He was a Marxist atheist, very angry, filled with anger, had been in the army in Russia. I think everyone went to the army. Or not everyone, but he went to the army and was stationed in Siberia. I mean, this is a guy who really had me definitely an interesting life.

And in the midst of all this Marxist atheist anger that he was living inside of, he, you know, how sometimes like the way that we see the world can cause actual ailments. So he contracted tuberculosis and the doctor said to him, he was a medical doctor himself at that point. And so he, the doctors, other doctors besides him told him that he was gonna die and that he was either gonna die and or like give his whole family tuberculosis 'cause it's very contagious and he had at that time my mom, his wife and my brother who is eight years older than me. And so he freaked out and he was really desperate to find a solution.

And one of his students who was getting his dissertation in medicine said to him, "Hey, like when we talk to you, "it's like I have the secret, but you can't tell anyone, "but it would cure your tuberculosis. "And if I tell you, you can't tell anyone that I told you "because we'll look both get killed. "But all I ask is that you help me with my dissertation." So my dad was like, "Okay, I'll do anything at this point." Yeah, he was like, "Great, whatever, I'll do anything." And so he took him to the woods of Russia and introduced him to a secret shaman in the woods of Russia who practiced Hatha and Ayurveda and meditation as well as maybe he was Jewish, I'm not sure.

But he helped my father to cure himself of tuberculosis by the use of meditation and yoga. And my father during that time discovered the Torah and realized that not only was he non-navious, but that he was a Jew. Yeah, wow, wow, wow, wow. I mean, as someone, I'm Jewish, I grew up Jewish and it's interesting, and I work with a lot of spiritual, my work, my day job, I do like web consulting and my clients are all spiritual teachers. And what is my first client was actually Rambas and what has always struck me is there seems to be a very large amount of Jewish people who gravitate towards these esoteric, sometimes Eastern, sometimes not exclusively Eastern, but it's something that has just fascinated me.

It's just so apparent to me. I have my own theory that I think a lot of Tibetan and places where there were spiritual kind of troubles. I think that a lot of them reincarnated as Jews because there's a tremendous history of suffering in the Jewish culture, and I've just noticed it. So it's fascinating to me that in somewhere like Russia, where your dad was, and your family was clearly oppressive, right? That he's going out to the woods to learn about Hatha Yoga and Ayurveda, that to me is fascinating. What, so from your memories of your father, when you were learning about these things and doing the eye gazing and finding this out, like what were some of the things that you were studying or learning with him?

Oh my God, everything, you know. He didn't believe in like, he was really an anarchist when it came to philosophy and spirituality. He was very much of the mind that, you know, you shouldn't subscribe to anything, and that if you don't come up with your own religion, you are a fake, you know? He was like, you have the responsibility, he would say he had a thick accent, he was so funny, he was like, you have a responsibility in this time to come up with your own religion. You know, he's like, because it is too late for you. He was like, if you want to be born 2,000 years ago where you get handed a religion, like you were born too late, like this is not the time for that.

This is a time of awakening where people will have to be responsible for creating something of their own. And so I read everything, I read Ram Das, oh my God, Ram Das was such an inspiration to me. And I started reading at nine, like I was reading everything from Eric from to Sigmund Freud to Marcus Aurelius. I mean, it just went the gamut.

I love it. I mean, one of my favorite mystics is Sri Ramakrishna. And one of the reasons I resonate with him, well, there's a couple reasons, but one is, I love that he worshiped and his deity was a colleague. I love that it was a female and a woman and that to me, really it was just very important because in an age where he really just didn't hear about that stuff, especially in the 19th century and before, but the other thing that I really love about him, which is pretty much aligned with, I think your father believed, which is there's a lot of paths up the mountain, but the view is the same.

And I think especially in this day and age, I mean, your father clearly tuned into this now with the internet and just how easy it is to access so many things. I think that this is the new kind, I don't wanna, I'm very cautious to call it a religion, but I totally agree that developing your own sense of your spirituality, whatever people wanna call it, is so important, especially like, I see in the new, I'd love to talk about this with you. You know, the new age movement that has sprouted in the past few decades and especially now seems to be inundated with very quick fixes, follow this teacher and then you're gonna be enlightened and do this and this is the path.

And then if you just adhere to these seven easy steps, you're gonna get there and to me that is, you know, not only not necessarily true, but also can be a major disservice to people who are genuinely seeking because it takes it away from the individual, it puts it externalized. So how about, can you talk a little bit about your practice and just what you're trying to do in meditation? I love that you're a meditation teacher who's bucking a lot of trends and also right in the heart of New York, where I think the meditation is gonna come in handy for a lot of people, can you talk a little bit about that?

Which aspect?

Just your particular practice and then what you're doing for yourself and I assume, you know, the service aspect of meditation for others.

Okay, yeah, I mean, so it was like a, it came together over time. So a part of my story is that after like being raised in this really holistic way, I didn't have anything to rebel against 'cause my dad was a raving lunatic. So like it was like, he was like, whatever you want to, like I remember I was like 12 and he was like, if you want to have sex, just use condom, you know? And I was like, I don't have sex to add him 12. And he was like, whatever. He was like, you don't need to tell me the truth, I understand. And I was like, no, but I'm really like not having sex. And it was like just awkward, just awkward, but not even like he really took it there.

He took it there to such a place of like wacko, like oversharing that like I didn't even, it was didn't even phase me, you know? But so after like I better on 20, I started drinking. I'd always been depressed 'cause like having my family die, all of them was like not at all easy. And I wasn't, I turned into like this very dismal when on a writer type of in Beetlejuice character, you know? Just like really depressed. And I just thought that's how things were. Like I would sit in diners with like, you know, black clothes on and like a ripped leather jacket and like sit for hours discussing like Sartre and the meaning of life and like smoking cigarettes is back when you could smoke cigarettes and diners.

Like it was just crazy. And I'd have these girlfriends that like, were very fascinated by me. So we could just sit there for hours, just like with, you know, me going on and on and on about like my beliefs about the world or whatever. And then, and then so finally at 20, I discovered alcohol. And I was like, oh, like, wow, this is amazing. Like why didn't someone tell me there was like some kind of a solution for this, you know? And so I started drinking and I drank really heavily. I mean, not, I drank really normally but like a lot for about five years. And my life went nowhere. Like I still had mystical adventures in that I like worked at an avant-garde cinema house and I fell in love and tried toward the country.

I like shaved my head and toward the country. But like in a way, my life was really like going nowhere. And it was as a result of the drinking. And then the good news was after about five years of that, I discovered cocaine and heroin.

This is the good news.

I was like, yay, this is even better. Like now I don't have to even eat, you know? I can just be high all the time. And so I did that for about four years as well. And I got sober at 29 and that was seven years ago or like seven years ago. - Congratulations, that's awesome.

Thank you. But I tell this whole story because I feel like it plays a huge role in like why meditation has became what I do for a living because by the time I got sober, like I knew nothing was as important to me as getting high all the time. So then when I got sober, the question was just going to be how am I going to get high all the time? Sober. And so I got back into my meditation roots and began really like I fully jumped into what I had been doing with my father prior to beginning my drinking journey. And it got so good, so fast that the next step for, I'm sure any spiritual teacher you talk to will tell you like when it gets that good, you don't have a choice but to share it with others.

'Cause you just become like, all right, well, I'm blissed out, like I'm done, I'm cooked. So like what can I do for others now? And so I started a group like I founded a meditation system which is called Center of the Cyclone. And my vision was to bring meditation to normal people inside of art galleries and more cultural intellectual spaces rather than having people have to go to an ashram. In the '60s, it was easier 'cause everyone was tripping on acid. So like to get a bunch of normal yuppies to go to an ashram and hang out with Ram Das in the '60s is easier 'cause they were high on LSD. But now no one's high on LSD or most people aren't.

I mean, some people are doing ayahuasca but whatever, it's not the same, it's really enough the same. So now it was really a question of this is a new wave and there isn't this divide and I didn't feel at home with the whole like bindi-wearing chanting community and I didn't feel at home with the atheist, staunch intellectual arts community 'cause I felt either way I was missing something. So I was like, we need a place where people who care about money and fashion and success and music and art and cinema can come together and do spiritual stuff.

I love it, I love it. I absolutely love it. I mean, what it sounds like, and these are my favorite types of people, you're a bridge builder, right? You're trying to bridge these gaps between exactly what you're talking about, the whole chanting, Eastern, which if that's, I work with these people, these I have friends who are heavily involved with that scene, but if it doesn't resonate with you as a person, it's not gonna work in the same way. And then you also, I mean, lived in New York. I lived in New York. You know, there's a whole culture of people who just, just by looking at those people would tune it out and say, well, that's not a real thing.

I'm not gonna do that in a naval casing. So I love that you're bridging that because that to me, that's what I'm basically, that's what the point of this podcast is. I call it a half spiritual podcast, half a podcast where I just talk to people I think are cool because the normalization of these seemingly esoteric concepts, something like meditation, have tremendously practical benefits for people's lives. Like that's the clear selling point for it. If you wanna say there's a selling point for meditation in the modern age, like this can actually help people. I love that you said that once you kind of get it, you wanna share because that's been, that's my experience.

I'm certainly not enlightened. I'm certainly not even close, but I know akin to something like the Bodhisattva's Val, like I would love to stave off my enlightenment until we can get as many people as possible until everyone really connects with their deeper selves and higher selves, whatever you wanna call it. So I absolutely love that. Could you talk, I know you had a music career too, and I know you're still making music, which I love, and that's one of my biggest passions in life. And I know this kind of merges in a little bit with the further future stuff. So we can go there. Could you talk a little bit about your musical career and what it is you love about music so much, I'm sure?

Yeah, I don't have a choice when it comes to music. Like I was born, yeah, you know, as a musician. Like I was born this way. It's like a disease. Like you don't have, you know, I sing all the time. I sing on the subway, like I sing in the bathroom. I sing as I walk through my hallway. I don't even notice that it's happening. It's like it's just happening to me. I'm like possessed. So I started singing when I was a baby as well, like meditating and singing from birth. And I came out of the womb, like and started singing and they called me the singing baby. It was really weird. And then when I was 18, I got signed to Sony, which back then there was a lot of money in Sony.

So they just recorded the record, like rode me around in limos and then I dropped, you know, shelved the record. That was like the whole story. And then yeah, and then after that, I decided to go. I shaved my head and like toured on AMP. Like I took AMP track across the country.

And like trains on the road.

They're so amazing. Totally. I love them. And I was also like able to do it alone 'cause I don't know, I don't even know how to drive. It was like a natural New Yorker. So I still didn't pick that one up. So I was just like, here I go, I'm off. And so I did music. I've recorded like several little records, but since I spent my 20s being really, really, really wasted, I usually just ended up like underneath someone's grand piano and a mansion, like singing. But like it went nowhere. Again, like I remember like snorting lines off of a toilet bowl with one of the biggest producers, music producers, like in the world and thinking, wow, it's finally happening.

But like nothing was happening. We were just snorting cocaine off of a toilet bowl, you know? I was like, oh my God, it's all coming together.

That's what I always, I did cocaine for a couple years, three years in my early 20s. And what I always, why I didn't like the way I felt the day after, but what always turned me off about cocaine was there were so many grandiose conversations and feelings and things. And then they almost never materialized into anything else. And that always disappointed me, I totally, I understand what you're saying completely related to that. But yeah, please continue, sorry to cut you off.

No, I appreciate it. I totally relate and that's exactly it. My life was just like an endless stream of conversations about how amazing I was and no action to prove that. So when I got sober, that was the first time in my life that I actually got to be an embodiment of success. And actually like what's really more courageous than success 'cause success is a result created by something that I have no control over. But it's really the admission of what's the word ambition. Like I hadn't ever admitted that I was so ambitious and there was this pain all over my body from hiding it. And I would walk around being like, I'm so cool and like I don't care at all about anything.

And I was like, the moment I became pre was the moment I just said, I really, really, really care. Like I really, I really wanna matter in this world. I wanna make a difference and I get to. I felt like I was gonna throw up the first time I said that because it just felt so vulnerable.

Yeah, well it sounds like you aligned your intent with like the deeper parts of your being. And when that happens, it can be a very scary thing to do. I totally get that. That's pretty amazing. That's cool that you've got these, I mean, you're clearly a very attuned person, right? I'm sure your intuition is on, you know, blast. Like you have a very, I get it. But I think that's amazing that you have these like palpable visceral experiences. Like that, that's been something in my life that has really kind of solidified a lot of these, you know, spiritual things is I get physical sensations that validate whatever is going on in my psyche or around in the world.

And I think that's really important too. And I think my personal hunch is that everyone has access to those types of things, but they're numbed, right? Sometimes through drugs, sometimes through alcohol, sometimes through people who can use people as drugs too. So I think that's really cool that you have those like palpable experiences that, you know, kind of, you know, show you what's going on. That's awesome.

Yeah, it is, it's awesome and also like brutal.

Yeah.

It is kind of like the touchstone to awakening. And I too am not enlightened, but I certainly live in a different state of consciousness than I once did. And it's like the touchstone to it is really shocking. And it has to be shocking. And actually the practice that I've created through using all ancient techniques, like none of this is really mine except for the music. But it's like the techniques create a necessary shock without like, it's sort of like, let's skip the car accident and the near death experience. And let's just do this meditation technique, which is really shocking. And if I shock people this way and I give them the opportunity to shock themselves, they actually don't get that necessarily, but what I'm doing is helping them live a life where they won't be shocked by the universe.

Yes.

Because if we just shock ourselves enough and the universe is like, okay, they're fine.

It's totally true. I mean, that is something I can tell you when I was having, you know, transcendental experiences, sometimes brought on by psychedelics, sometimes just not, what quickly happened for me is I got overwhelmed almost all the time early on, which when you're getting overwhelmed by something, but you don't have the space to process it, it's not always as valuable. So providing kind of a context where people can process something big, deep, whatever you wanna call it and then go through it and use it as a tool. And that's pretty, yeah, listen, I'll say this, I haven't heard of any of your meditations, I haven't meditated with you, but I'm looking forward to doing it at some point because this sounds really, really, really cool.

Can you tell me, not to shift gears too abruptly, but can you tell me how you connected with the people from further future? And I would love to hear how that came about because that's how we got introduced. And I don't know Jordan well, I just reached out to them 'cause it's like, I love what you're doing. It's been a huge electronic music fan my entire life. I love this merging of spiritual, ecological thinking, philosophical, musical thing that's taking place there. So I'd love to hear how you kind of got involved with that.

Yeah, yeah, it's actually tied to the music. So then what happened in the midst of this spiritual journeys, I gave up everything about three and a half years ago when I got a message from within myself that I was meant to be a spiritual teacher, which I was like, you've got to be kidding me, I don't know. I was just like, I'd always pictured a spiritual teacher as like some old dude with a beard 'cause that's what my dad looked like. And so when the memo was given to me that I was a spiritual teacher, I was like, no, but that's not right. Like I'm this little white girl, like it's just not, no, I don't think so, you know?

And I took it on 'cause I kind of was done with the part of my life where I argued with my inner world. So my inner world wasn't like, this isn't a conversation. Like I'm just here to relay a message, which is your destiny. It's like, you're gonna just do what I tell you to do. And I was like, all right, fine. And I gave up everything, I gave up music. And I remember it being really painful. Like I felt really, like I was surrendering my greatest love 'cause at that time, I was just like this starving artist who was only pursuing her music and living off nothing and just being super focused. 'Cause I'm like, one thing I can say about myself is I'm an artist and that's it.

Like I'm not someone who is gonna make it any other way. Like I wasn't gonna be like, you know what? I'm just gonna derail from this and become like a tax attorney or like, you know? Like it just wasn't, I just am an artist. It's like all that I, it's my essence and it's all I'm willing to accept. And so like even if that meant what it meant back then, which was suffering, which I had to surrender. And I had to surrender suffering, but I did it through this relinquishing. I gave up everything to just become a spiritual teacher, which was very quick. Within a year, like my business skyrocketed. I went from like 12 people to 100 people in my events.

And I'm not really, I don't consider them classes. They're more like experiences. Like art, art installation meets meditation. And so like a year and a half into it, I got another vision and the vision was, you're supposed to now make music. And so I was like, what? Like you told me not to do that. You told me to give up the music. So like to become a spiritual teacher. And the voice was like, yeah, now you get to do both. And I was like, what? Like then it's like the brain exploded. Like that's like the third part of the movie, you know, like three quarters of the way you have your, like, oh my God.

So then I like raised money on an arts platform through proud funding and recorded my new record. And this new record sort of sounds like Enya meets Coldplay.

Oh my God.

Yeah.

It's pretty awesome.

It's awesome. And so now I score my meditations with my music. And I think by the time the word got to further future about me, it's like what I'm known for is this music and the scoring of this meditation experience with this music. And I'm actually booked to perform at Wanderlust as well as Soul Camp and some other festivals like I'm performing at. So they heard about me and they were like, here's this girl who can do both. And they connected me to other sound artists who are going to be at the festival. So we're going to be collaborating and creating soundscapes during like the sunrise and maybe the sunset type of experiences as well as me guiding these meditations, which I do for now for hundreds of people.

I gotta say, I'm really happy for you. Like it's just very clear when things are clicking and they're working and you're in the flow. And I'm sure you experience it, but it's just, it's very obvious to me. I love that also you spoke about, there's this funny thing that happens, right? You spoke about something which is very high level to me, which is surrendering your suffering. That's, now that's a concept I don't know that how many people are actually going to get this, but the other thing I love is in the Bhagavad Gita, which I don't mean on it heavily, but there's something that always struck me, which is do not be attached to the fruits of your labors.

And it seems like as soon as you detach from the fruits of your labors, whether that was the suffering or being an artist or this conception of self, this paradoxical thing happens, which is that's when things start to blow in. It's like the Alan Watts statement who says, have you ever noticed that people who are generous are like rivers? The more they give away, the more flows in. When you create a vacuum, more flows in, that's like the natural law. And that to me, that's been my life too. That's how my success and career, I think I hedged my bets a little bit. I didn't go full bore, but I figured out a way to take my passions and skills and merge them.

So I'm walking that line between, yes, I'm a web consultant, and I do a lot of business-related and systems things, but they're all in the spiritual sector. They're all fundraising consciousness in a way. So, and I'm also a musician. And I love seeing someone like you and hearing from you, who has done these things and is reaping the rewards, but yet isn't attached to them. And I think walking that line is so critically important. And I just love to see and hear from you about that. So that's really great. So, can you describe a little bit about what your meditation experiences are like? I'd love to hear more about it, and I'm sure the listeners would too, because they sound like you're selling me.

So, I definitely want to hear more, yeah.

That's so cool. I think that what someone might say about being in my presence is that I'm really down to earth. And so, like my, I'm not allowed to curse.

You can say whatever the fuck you want.

Okay, cool. It's not a lot of bullshit, you know? Like, I don't have a prescribed script that I use. So, I'm never saying the same things. Not that I don't, I teach, like there's only 48 laws to the universe in the system that I study. So, like, you know, or whatever, you know? So, like these things will come up again. But the truth is, is that I am never the same. So, I don't interact with anyone truth the same way today as I did yesterday. And so, I give a talk in the beginning of my experiences. I'll pick a topic like last time I did an event that was on buffers than in the time before that.

It was on Zen ox herding. And so, I just pick things from my own, like, you know, library of studies, something that fascinates me and that awaken, that has awoken my spirit while I was traveling. And then I speak on that from my own experience and helping people to fully understand it. And I think that one thing that I've been gifted is the ability to, like, take huge, big, big concepts and distill them into really simple ideas. And that's just like what the gods gave me. And so, I tend to have the attention of a large audience. Like, I don't lose a lot of people because it isn't boring and it isn't dogmatic.

And then after I'm done talking, which is usually, like, 20 minutes or so, then I'll take people into the meditation. And it's about 20 minutes of breathing and sense deprivation and oaming. And there's a few other techniques in there. And then after that, I bring them out and have them do this ancient Sufi eye gazing technique, which is actually, like, the crystalline. It's like the gem of my experience. And so, I have them partner up, although recently I've been doing this thing called circle of light as well, which means that everyone is gazing, which is like a whole 'nother universe. Yeah, but then I have them partner up and gaze one into each other's eyes.

And there's a special technique around that also that's called divided attention. So I teach people a tool that they can go on and, like, use in their regular life, like out in the world.

Oh, I think we'll love it.

Yep, and then I blast my record, like, while this is happening. So it's sort of like being in, like, a Pearl Jam video. 'Cause that's your meditating.

I really wanna hear the music too. I love that the eye gazing and the Sufi stuff is a part of it. One of my favorite, favorite mystics is Hazrat Inayat Khan. And I love his metaphors from the Sufi tradition of how people are like bells, right? And when one bell rings, it resonates with another bell and it can create this cascading flow of, like, harmonies and melodies. I love it. I'm really enjoying this conversation.

Yeah, you too, oh my God.

So what, I mean, what are some real practical tips that you would communicate to the listeners? This is something I ask in every podcast because to me, it's great to talk about all of this stuff, but I also am fundamentally interested as it seems like you are, it's like, we want this to benefit people. We want people to get something out of this that they can then extend and take an integrate into their lives and potentially help themselves and then by proxy help the people around them. So what would you say? I know, I think one of yours is one of my favorite ones, which is gratitude. That's like my favorite, like, hack of life.

I hate to use that word, but that is just like, that's the thing. So what are some other practical tips that have helped you and you have noticed that have helped others?

Hmm, I mean, I think like one of them is radical joy. And when I say radical, I just mean it goes against everything that is mechanical in us to experience joy. And it takes a lot of effort. Like people think that they should just feel happy or they should just feel joyful. That's actually not the case. Like if you, that's not the case.

So it's like really weird expectation. And I know I myself am a victim. I've been a victim of that like disillusion. Like I'm just like, why am I not happy? Like, what do you mean? Like I don't just get to have that, but it requires so much effort. And everything you think would be good for it. Like you're probably right. So for instance, like if you're thinking, you know, might be good if I work out today for at least 45 minutes, you're probably right. That will induce a state of joy in your body. If you think stopping to meditate for half an hour will enhance your day, you're right. The problem is that like the machine in which we live will work really hard to talk us out of these things.

Very hard, very hard.

Billions of dollars are spent to talk us out of these things. Trillions of dollars are spent to make us not acknowledge the little still voice within. So that's definitely true.

Yeah, and I don't even, I mean, I don't get like the whole like how it's all happening. But I actually think even if I was like alone on a deserted island and nobody and nothing was influencing me, the tragedy of being in a human body with a human mind actually means that I am predisposed to have this conflict. So I don't, yeah, I don't even look outside myself to like the boring, you know, conflicts that are happening around me or star magazine or whatever, 'cause those are problems. But I think those are really manifestations of like the real problem at hand, which is that the situation in which we live, whether it be planetary, like I don't know, there's theories that once this planet was like inside of a golden halo and everybody was high as a kite.

I'm sure you've read some books that talk about that.

Yeah, this is just not the time that we live in. You know, it's just not, it's just not.

It certainly is not.

This is why we have further future.

Yeah.

Because we need to like go to the desert and put on like we're in boots, so like experienced, experienced in the consciousness.

It's nuts. I mean, I think what you're also referring to here in no small part is these are karmic influences that we can't actually understand intellectually or even as humans, but these are probably the ramifications of decisions that we've made individually, collectively as a society, as souls, as whatever, and we're feeling those, I love, love, love that you pointed out that it's not just the external circumstances that kind of don't allow us to engage with these things. There is some aspect of the human condition that does make us feel that way. What I also love about the human condition is we have the ability to transcend that if we put in the effort and we choose to do it, which is hugely important.

So yeah, I mean, we're just, I'm getting the epiphanies left and right talking to you. This is amazing. So I would love to continue this conversation at a later time. Like I said, the next time I'm in New York, I definitely would love to link up. Is there anything you would like to touch on that I didn't bring up at all? I'm going to have links and information and do a huge introduction before this episode. But if there's anything you would like to communicate, this would be the time.

I mean, everything that we covered is mainly what I do. I think the only add on to that is that sometimes I take on a few private students. So if anyone is interested in that, it's something that I don't have a lot of, but it's like, I don't know if you call it client or student, but these are people that I take on the journey on a one-on-one level.

Very, very cool.

And that's my life right there, and I'm not sure. I also have a cat.

What's your cat's name?

Mukti, of course. (laughing)

That's awesome, that's so cool. This is great. Well, thank you again for coming on. I'm looking forward to connecting some more in the future. And I wish you the best of luck and success. I'm sure it'll find you. You don't need to find it because it's very clear. This is just an audio conversation. It's so different than being in person, or even seeing each other, but it's clear that you're doing something you believe in, and it's helping you, and it's helping other people. And to me, that's what it's all about. I think that's why we're here. So thank you again, yet, for coming on.

Thank you, Noah. So good to meet you.

So good to meet you.

All right. (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (singing in foreign language) (singing in foreign language) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (gentle music) (gentle music) (gentle music) (singing in foreign language) (gentle music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) That a nice song. The whole album is like that too.

This is Beatz Simkin's "The Lunar Album." Really, really, really, really, really great. I've been listening to it for a week. And I think she described it as Enya and Coldplay. And it is, you may not like either of those, but you should, especially Enya, Enya's the best. But this album is really, really good. So I wanted to remind you, if you're able, check out this further future festival in Las Vegas at the end of April, 2016, in case this is someone listening. Far in the future, it's done. It's done if this is past April 29th to May 1st, 2016. But if it's not, I recommend checking it out. Like I said, I'd be going.

I just happened to be having another human being who I've helped create come into the world. So I can't attend. Again, be it links to everything we spoke about, including Viet's website and some other stuff she does, are on the podcast pages. So go there. If you want to see it, rate and review, subscribe to Synchronicity. If you want, if not, no big deal. Again, book club, book club, now it's not a book club. It's a book giveaway. If you want to have a chance to win a free book, brand new book, again, all you do is you go to syncpodcast.com and you put in your email, you're in the Synchronicity community.

You're going to get a weekly email from me recapping the show and the guest and some other cool things I did. Like I put together a playlist of music for my people on the community. I don't know why I use that weird kind of, you know, herky, jerky speech thing there. Sorry. But yeah, that's it. I'll see you next week. Oh, and bonus, I have soon. Duncan Trussell sat down with him on his bus after his You Are God tour a week ago. So that's coming out maybe next week, maybe the week after, maybe the week after, maybe the week after. Got a lot of people coming, but that's a really cool one. So stay tuned for that.

So I will see you next week. [MUSIC PLAYING] [MUSIC PLAYING] (upbeat music)