Ep. 44 - Lulu Biazus

I am living in L.A. so there's that new age community, that the yet-being new age community. And I feel like everyone in my neighborhood has done ayahuasca. This is synchronicity. This is synchronicity. This is synchronicity. This is synchronicity. This is synchronicity. This is synchronicity! [music] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [waves crashing] [music] Welcome to episode 44 of this extra, extra relaxed episode of synchronicity. My guest today is Lulu Biazzas. You know, it occurs to me, Lulu, if you're listening, I know you're gonna listen to this.

I never said your name out loud, so correct me. If I, your last name, at least, so I think I got the Lulu part down. But the Biazzas, Biazzas, you're gonna let me know how to pronounce that. Got a great show for you today. As you can tell by the extended intro, I am at the beach. I'm loving the beach. I'm staying at the beach. I'm gonna extend this trip to two more weeks. I'm gonna get back to work, of course, but geographically speaking, I'm gonna stay here for a while. It's really nice. Right by the ocean. Got a lovely view. This episode is brought to you by good vibes, fun times. That, of course, was Enya, the music, if you enjoyed it.

I have no rights or permissions to use that whatsoever. So Enya, come at me if you want to. What you're gonna do about it? Using your music. I bought it, so hopefully. Hopefully we're okay, Enya. I'm a big fan. This episode is really fun. It was just a casual conversation between friends. Lulu is out in LA doing really cool stuff. She's an art director, creative person, just extraordinarily lovely and wonderful. I think you're really gonna like this episode. A reminder, quick reminder. There's no book giveaway this week, but the Synchronous City Generosity Experiment. We're about to close that up in a few days here.

If it's past August 2016, then it's already closed. You can go look at the results. It wasn't that cool. We got a neck and neck tie for the places the money is going. If you want to know what the hell I'm talking about, I have no idea. Or if you do have an idea and still want to know what I'm talking about, it is go to syncpodcast.com. S-Y-N-C podcast.com/generosity. You'll know everything I know. We're gonna decide based on the voting on that page where the money is gonna be going. That should be cool. Thank you to everyone who is donating and contributing directly to the episode. That really means a lot to me.

It is validation in more ways than one. We talked about that a little bit in this episode, Lulu and I. Some of the stuff we're trying to do with MindPod Network. We have some cool stuff coming out with that. So, yeah, what else I got to say? Nothing. That's it. Rate and review. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah. Might as well say that, right? I think that's it for this week. I had some other stuff written down. I'm gonna save it for next week. Got some cool people coming up. I think you're really gonna enjoy. But without further ado, here is Lulu. Yes, yes. Thank you so much for agreeing to come on.

This is awesome. I feel very honored and I'm very happy to know you. Oh, well, okay. So, let's jump in. We were talking about Burning Man, right? We were talking about how we should think we feel like we should go. We haven't gone. I kind of feel like Burning Man, how I do about ayahuasca. I've never done ayahuasca, but everyone who I hear speak about it, it sounds like something I'm eventually know I'm going to do if I don't even have immediate plans to do it in the future. You know what I mean? That's how I feel about Burning Man at this point. I agree. I mean, if we're comparing it to ayahuasca, I feel like that scared me so much that I was happy I did it.

Yeah. I don't know if I want to go back, so maybe I shouldn't go to Burning Man. When did you do ayahuasca? That was maybe two and a half years ago, and it was right before Phil and I started dating, and it's probably why we started dating because I had a lot of breakthroughs on that. I mean, I think it just shows you how to have a breakthrough if you've never had one before, or if you've had a minor breakthrough on mushrooms or something. But I felt like it shows you how to make those connections visually, but then you remember how to make those breakthrough connections experientially. So then you continue having them, and I feel like I can still have many during meditation, but I don't think you need to do ayahuasca to have those.

I think some people might just be more advanced humans and be capable of achieving that without having to go through Dante's Inferno. Right. Well, and that's why I hear it described a lot, too, is to get to the breakthroughs. You do kind of got to go through the stuff that's there in your own inner world and obscuring whatever we believe our true nature to be. There's stuff. There's muck. There's dirt. There's stuff. Some can form in this life, previous lives, however you view it all. It's something that I've heard the same thing from people who do it. It really does seem like it is referred to as a medicine, and it does seem of all the psychedelics at least, especially because it comes from such a ritualistic and kind of like, there's a way to do it and experience it, and it's been passed down through traditions.

And we don't really have that with something like LSD. We have that a little bit with mushrooms. Like I just recently met someone who is like a mushroom shaman. Like that was his gig. That was, he was a real dude who's been doing it for 30 years, and I had never even heard of that, right? To me, it was just something that grows everywhere. You take it and whatever it is, it is. And maybe there's some correlation to people who've taken it before, but kind of good luck. But ayahuasca, you know what I mean? I mean, mushrooms. I do know. You mean that. So, I mean, but ayahuasca does have this kind of sacred medicine.

I know it's very like, you know, protected. I mean, I think it was protected, and I think it's become like Burning Man, but, you know, it's just becoming, I know so many people, and I am living in LA, so there's that New Age community, but yet being New Age community. And, you know, I'm sure like I'm being hypocritical even saying this, but I feel like everyone in my neighborhood has done ayahuasca. Right. And it's not something secret anymore, and a lot of, there's a lot of ceremony that's watered down. And my experience was very traumatic with it. I think I had PTSD, and I did it here. But I was thinking about how it isn't treated like this precious ceremony anymore.

And everyone in that community, like Burning Man, I think, keeps talking about how it's removed from its context. Right. And how, and I don't know about mushrooms. Like, I think it is great to have a mushroom shaman, because I've had some really weird experiences where no one was sitting. And it was just like-- Well, no sideways, yeah. It goes sideways, and you're suddenly like in this, you know, altered dimension that's like Dr. Seuss. Yeah. And I know it. And I mean, we've all been there, and you're like, when is this over? I think I have to wait, you know. I think six hours or something. Yeah, exactly.

What is that? How fast is time moving? Wait, is this forever? Those are the worst options. I know, especially if it's, you know, you get caught in a loop, and you're like, oh, man. But yeah, I don't know why I brought that up, except that I think we're in an interesting time where I wonder if ayahuasca is just going to become eventually like this mushroom thing, which I don't know. Mushrooms aren't super hard to find in Los Angeles. They're easy everywhere. They're everywhere. They grow everywhere. I mean, they're in places where like Florida, where there's like, you know, hillbillies growing, you know, like truthfully.

I mean, that's-- Yeah, I mean, it just grows on the cow shit. I mean, that's one of the reasons I think it spread so much, and I think it probably had a decent amount to do with like how consciousness is potentially-- I mean, I look at a lot of these things as like symbiotic kind of-- I include weed here too. That's like my spirit animal is weed, right? Yeah, we're going to talk about that too. Yeah, definitely. I wonder about ayahuasca too, and it's the same kind of protectiveness. I mean, because like mindfulness is another good correlation between it, right? Yeah. And there's even a term "mick mindfulness" because everyone now-- because it's such a useful and beneficial thing potentially can be helpful, which is even a potentially a pitfall with mindfulness.

But everyone knows the word. Everyone is doing it from whoever you can imagine. And it loses some of the zest with the lineage that comes to this-- I was talking about this with Sharon Salz work about this. She was-- she gave a story where she's like-- she asked someone-- they're like, "I'm a meditation teacher." And she's like, "Oh, awesome. Like, who did you study with?" Like what-- and they're like, "What do you mean?" Like, "I'm just a meditation teacher." "I'm not a mindfulness teacher." And she's like, "Oh, okay." Not in like a derogatory way, but she's like, you know, we learn this from people who it's been passed down for thousands of years through a specific way, not that you have to adhere to some type of rigid dogma, but that like this is-- these are transmissions that get passed down through any ways that you can believe, whether you believe in reincarnation or not.

You can pass down things through generations by teaching them. So I also wonder if a lot of the psychedelics-- I mean, this is even back to like high school days when I just started doing psychedelics, right? People-- some people did it just like, let's get fucked up, right? Let's just get fucked up and see what's going on. And some people-- I always, after the first time, I took it was like, that is so fucking crazy. That is some completely ridiculously other world that I've never experienced. It totally throws the context of my regular perspective into total chaos. Like, I got to treat this with some type of respect.

And I want to go figure out what the hell is going on. So I do wonder if that reverence or respect for these things, or if it's watered down or, you know, spiritually materialistically appropriated, whether that, I mean, is it a big deal? Is it something we have to be concerned about happening? Will we naturally gravitate to people who are doing the real thing and that those other people-- hopefully it's not us. Some other people are doing this. You know, like, in it, it always isn't-- I think about the same thing. I think about the same thing all the time. And I don't-- I wonder the same thing.

And if those-- I like the word transmission that you use. Yeah. I think that's a really good way to put it. And I wonder if those transmissions were created to protect the people, like to keep it elitist, or-- which I do not agree with. But it-- like, a part of me wonders, like, why we're only certain people used to transmit this information. And it did kind of keep it more exclusive. Right. But then, again, not really because I feel like ancient wisdom is around for a reason. Like, people needed it. Yes. I don't know. I'm trying to think, like, at this point-- by the way, my dogs are being hectic right now.

It's OK. What kind of dogs do you have? There are two Italian greyhounds. Cool. They're being nuts. I'll show you later. No. I think-- I went to two ayahuasca ceremonies. I do not want to name names. And I would never. Right. But they were, you know, like 20-somethings who invited me to experience their ceremony that they were running. I asked who did they learn from? And they learned from someone who's my age. Right. Like, in their 30s. And I thought that was kind of weird. And I was like, OK. And I just sat with sat in the ceremonies. And I didn't partake. Right. But everyone in the ceremony is probably, like, 18.

And 18 to 21. And the people performing the ceremonies are really young. Right. And there is a sense of anxiety. Like, I didn't have that feeling of-- Right. --someone sitting with that wisdom. Right. Where you feel like you can really go deep. Right. It just felt very, you know, like, very, very-- And I feel like that's a lot of ceremonies now. Because I talked to a lot of-- I mean, I feel like the community that I'm in right now, and Phil and I both work with a lot of younger-- I don't want to say kids because they're not. They're adults. But, like, we work with a lot of people who are younger than us.

And there is a sense of, like, floating. And no one has these anchored people in their life. And I do think that the ayahuasca ceremonies and all these things are, like, this attempt to find an anchoring. But then, so there is something that's-- we're missing ancient wisdom. The thing that anchors, yeah. Yeah. That is the anchoring. So I think a lot of why we have this anxiety in our culture is because we don't use the community for that ancient wisdom. It's-- And that kind of makes me sad. I don't know. Like, I'm trying to bring older people that I work with, like, my meditation teachers into the younger community.

But I don't know if they necessarily even know how to utilize that type of wisdom. You know, it's an interesting thing. And that's part of what, you know, we've spoken about MindPod Network a bunch in a lot of different ways. And that's something that, you know, I've been privy to to see how people who are young still do connect with someone like Rhombas or Alan Watts, right? Yeah. People who transcended their cultural paradigms. Also, let's be real. What's going on now in history is so reminiscent of the '60s, late '60s, '70s, like, really this-- It is. It is. It's almost, like, funny. It's, like, almost, like, lifting over the veil and being, like, it's not-- I say it's the same thing.

No such thing as time. These things just matter. So that's very interesting. But I have seen younger people gravitate to it. And, like, you know, you meet someone from, like, some remote part of this country who really has no community around them. And these people reach out to me through this podcast, through other people I work with. And, you know, it's-- you see that it's not something that's, like, necessarily locally or physically communicated. Like, some people are just born knowing this stuff. They may not know how to express it. They may feel isolated and weird. But then they link up with other, like, minded people.

And now through the internet, that's easier to do. You know, it's insane how easy it is to do. You and me remember when the internet didn't work like this. Yeah. There was no internet. Yeah. It was busy signals on phones. Like, you know. Yeah. But now it's so easy to do this that you wonder-- it really is an incredible time in terms of being able to access and learn information. But that can promote exactly what you're talking about is this airiness. And I've experienced this personally psychically. Like, you know, in my own psyche. You have you go too far off into space. It can be amazing. It can be beautiful.

But unless you totally jump off the edge with no return ever, you know, you're done. You're checking out. You're going off the grid for good. Like, you're going to come back to reality at some point and have to deal with the things that are still there in your life. So it is interesting. And I think that's just a younger growing up in this world type of mentality. You know what I mean? Like, we grew up in a culture and all the people you're working with grew up in a culture where we kind of have an operating system that you're born into. And you don't-- you may be unique and you may have extra perspectives and all this extra stuff.

But you're born into a system that is there. Like, we see this very clearly with the political system, you know, entertainment systems, news systems. It's there. So trying to navigate that is interesting. But like I said, I do believe that the younger generations will be able to latch on to something. I don't know that you-- like our age group is-- I think we are bridge people in a lot of ways because we grew up without this. And I think that is an important role for us. But I also think that people from younger generations can learn from older generations than us because there's a ton of stuff there.

There's like-- and it doesn't even have to be older generations. It could be like picking up a copy of the Dhammapada and be like, oh, Buddha said some interesting things. Like, this makes sense. This is something I can use as a map in my life right now knowing what I know in modern times. So there's tools out there. But I've-- I do come across what you come across. This-- this floatiness, not in myself and other people. And it's-- it's very interesting. I know-- Me too. Me too. And I kind of-- I'm wondering, like, what is a good way to-- be a bridge person. Yeah. And that's kind of where I find-- I'm really interested because I like-- I don't mind being someone who's older.

Right. Like, I actually enjoy that. Yeah. And enjoy-- I don't mind, you know, being the person that connects, you know, our 70-year-olds to our 20-year-olds. Right. Like, I think it's really cool. And I think, even visually and artistically, there is ancient wisdom. And a lot of people-- what I'm finding interesting is, like, working with older people who are in our community and, like, just the consciousness community. Yeah. A lot of them are surprised that younger people are interested in what they have to say. Yeah. Because-- Yeah. Like, what? Why wouldn't we be-- You know why, though? Because when they're growing up-- and I have a lot of friends who are of that age, you know, mid-60s to mid-70s, when they were growing up, their parents, for the most part, had apps-- there was no interfacing going on.

Those are people who grew up in such a completely different time, potentially war time, World War I, World War II. Like, just crazy changes, industrial-- you know what I mean? Like, industrialization, truthfully. That's like, we're going back to, like, 1800s for a lot of people, right? That's where their parents could have potentially been born. That's true. So that-- it's weird to them for a generation to be open-minded about what our elders or other people have to say, which I think is a luxury, at least in this country, that a lot of us grew up with. Like, we have the ability to, like, bring an open mind to this stuff.

We don't have to work from the age of eight to support our family, you know what I mean? Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, it's-- they're probably like, wow, you do want to hear what I have to say? Cool. Because we thought our grandparents were nerds. We didn't think like that. I never thought about it that way, but you're right. It's probably what it is. I think you're right. It's that mad men. They're from that culture. Right. I use that show because I think it's really on point. Yeah. I think that you're right. They're not used to being seen as equals by the younger generation. Yeah. I actually think that because the people that are at that age group that were around in the '60s, like, there are a lot of people that were, you know, revolutionaries at their time that are around right now.

Yeah. Yeah. And that's why I'm really interested because a lot of them are-- they're exactly who we are. Right. They're the same. They went through a little other. Right. And they're kind of-- they look at us like you said and they're just saying this is the same. Like, we're going through the same shit. Right. And it kind of blows my mind that when you talk to someone from that generation, they're kind of blown away that we relate so easily. Yeah. And that, you know, we totally respect one another in that way. It's got to be weird because, obviously, everyone came out of that time period in different ways.

You know, some of them, quote unquote, "normalized," right? Yes. I don't use the word "selling out" because I don't, because I think it puts me in a weird position in my life. I know. And I 100% view myself as someone who doesn't. I think my particular path, and I know a lot of other people who do this, on some parts, yes, I'd love to go meditate in a cave in an ashram and go around the world and go to these crazy places and study with every single person. But personally, deep down inside, I know that's not what I'm supposed to do. That's not what I'm supposed to be doing. It would be cool to experience a lot of those things, and I'm sure I will go to a lot of cool places.

But I know that the more effective place for me to be is in the world, in industries, and paying attention to comedians, and entertainers, and musicians, and artists, and popular culture, and not saying, "Oh, well, this is just separate. This is just something that doesn't have any value whatsoever." You know, being spiritual and detached from this is, I think the integration of those things is really what my particular path is. And I meet a lot of people who know that too, and you're not selling out. But I think a lot of people who are older, who went through the '60s, it felt like such a wave.

Like, I'm looking out. Like, I actually have the view of the ocean, like, right where we're talking. I'm very jealous that I can't see it, even live by curious. I'll turn it on after a recording, so you can see what I'm looking at. But what it feels like in the '60s, and I get this from a lot of people who live through it through various age groups, is that it felt like a wave was rising, right? Like, a big wave was rising, and that it was cresting. It was going to bring it. Yeah, it was going to usher in this new world of consciousness and love, and everyone was going to get it. And, you know, JFK was going to change the world, and we're all going to be taking acid in the White House.

And it's going to be like... Yeah, it's like... Yeah, exactly. Do it. Yeah. Exactly. Awesome power. Exactly. And the truth is, that didn't really happen the way most people imagined it too, right? It was like when you take acid or you take mushrooms or you take something and you crest up and it builds up, eventually it wears off and you come back to reality, right? That's reality, quote unquote. And so I think a lot of people came out of it in different ways. Some people got jaded. Some people were like, "Hey, this was a big failure. We didn't win. We lost. You know, look, everything that happened since then, we're worse off than we were.

We're taking over all of these things." And some people, I think, came out of it and say, "You know what? We didn't really lose. We were changed completely. We have friends who changed completely. Maybe they went into more traditional jobs, but they still maintain this sense of the world can be changed through what's going on." So I think the older generation sees our generation and the younger generation going through this same kind of thing. It also feels, you know, I didn't live back then, but it feels exacerbated at this point. It feels ramped up. It feels like, imagine if the internet existed in the '60s when it's like a Dell scheme and it seemed like that would have been fucking nuts.

It's not dissimilar to what we're doing with now. The fact that you're even saying that whether they're airy or fairy or kind of new agey or not, the fact that there's ayahuasca circles, and I know people too, I just had someone email me that there's an ayahuasca circle back in Maryland to where I live. And it sounds legit. It doesn't, you know what I mean? It's not like some phoneable thing. And so it's interesting that all of this stuff-- I hope the FBI doesn't start following us because of this podcast. You know, it's, here's the funny thing. I think with all of this stuff, like, and we're the DEA and all of this, you know, all the drug stuff, like, we just went through, like, two weeks ago, they chose to continue to classify marijuana as schedule one, which is like, I don't even know.

I mean, I-- I know that kind of broke my heart just because I know so many people with cancer and so many people who use it to-- some of them who don't go through doctors, but they have, you know, severe conditions and people who enjoy it. Right. I mean, it's really crazy that we're still-- I mean, I think it's only a matter of time, but the fact that one of the most powerful governments in the world can basically stand on an island and say there's no medicinal value whatsoever for this sub-plant. It's just like, it's bizarre to me, and it does. It's like one of those things, like, you look at kind of like Trump being a candidate for president.

It's like, how does this happen? Like, how-- how exactly did these forces-- is it something? Is it a dark secret cabal of people who are the Illuminati who are wielding this? Is it just ignorant people? Is it purely greed? Is there not a way for them to monetize it? Like, what the fuck is actually going on? You just vocalized every one of my theories, like, yes, is it? I'm like, is it an Illuminati that sets this up? And-- because it almost seems unreal, like, how-- you can't write this stuff, like, but can you? Because I feel like it's too far removed from reality to have someone, like, Trump.

Right. Like, running. Like, this can't be real. It's so-- I must feel like if it is an Illuminati type of situation, they went too far. Like, you should have gone someone a little bit more realistic. You went, like, full bozo of the clown when you could have just, like, gone, like, someone slightly weird looking-- like, I don't-- it's-- it is weird. I don't know how we got here. I don't know. I mean, I honestly feel-- here's the thing I've been doing. So I've been really getting into Tibetan Buddhism and Vajrayana and a big practice in Tibetan Buddhism, Padma Sambava, the kind of their guru Rinpoche, like, their avatar of a guy who passed down wisdom through thousands of years.

He's really-- he advocates something called dream yoga as a potential practice, which is you basically-- the essential gist of it is the reason you cultivate dream yoga as a practice is when you're sleeping, you can go into these basically transcendental pure realms and just meditate. More effective. And when you're sleeping, you basically can be burning off karma, like, because these are valid worlds, and they're barto states, much like after death is a barto state, and they're like, listen, here's the deal. Remind yourself that this world that we experience is a lot like a dream, that it's an illusory body type of-- it's not as solid as we think.

We know that when we go to sleep, we wake up in the same place, but what happens when we die, right? The dream dissolves. It's not the same thing that we thought it was. So to me, I've been doing that, I've been trying to remind myself-- and this is something people do when they're trying to lucid dream too. They try to-- you know, this is a dream. I'm dreaming. I'm looking at my hand, so then when they're sleeping and they're dreaming, they'll look at their hand and I'm like, oh, it's not really my hand, it's a good dream hand. And then they can start taking control, which is similar to the dream yoga stuff.

But-- That's so interesting. It's fascinating. I mean, one of the reasons I love the Tibetan stuff is they just-- they're so detailed and they're-- talk about lineage. Like that is one of the most incredible-- it's just amazing how they've passed all of this stuff down through thousands of years. Like, it's nuts. And it's so much care and it's passing down. I'm reading a book by this guy, Chongla Rinpoche, called my Tibetan life and lives. And basically, it's basically-- he grew up and was-- he like gave the Dalai Lama his oral instructions before when he got ordained as the Dalai Lama. So he lived in Tibet this entire time as the Chinese invaded and it's such a detailed and amazing picture of what Tibet was like because Tibet is-- you know, where it was-- it's protected by mountains geographically.

So no one could even get in there for like hundreds of years. So they developed this insane-- once Buddhism got there, this insane culture that they just talk-- it was such care and such reverence. And it's just even when the Chinese invaded. There's still all of this wisdom that escaped through them through so many teachers. It's just nuts. So anyway, back to the illusory book. I want to read that book. Oh, yes. I'll send you-- I'll put a link in to this podcast page and I'll send it to you in an email. I did it for a book giveaway for this podcast, I think, a couple of weeks ago. So I forgot who won it.

But really, it's such an awesome book. It's really, really cool. But so this illusory, this dreamlike world, to me, I feel like, like you said, like someone messed up, whether it's the Illuminati or us collectively kind of waking up from this. This election in particular, what sticks out to me as much as anything else, is that it oscillates between being totally fucking scary. Like holy shit, Donald Trump is basically like a couple steps away from Hitler. And like where he really has like a stone sparrow chance of getting into the White House, which is terrifying. And then it just oscillates between that and totally fucking batshit hilarious.

This is insane. How is this even a thing? This is like a joke. He is like a clown. And now we see the polls are kind of changing and people are kind of like, OK, this guy's not actually going to be president. But it feels like a dream. If you think about when you're dreaming, you can think about a place you're there. You're having an amazing time, whatever it is, whatever. And then it can turn on a dime, just like a psychedelic experience. And I feel like the world is just entering this super psychedelic state where like we are shaping reality so clearly, so clearly with our minds and our actions that this is just how it's manifesting.

And I do think that's where the value of places like Burning Man, things like ayahuasca, it can show you kind of how to act in that world or how to use it in a way that is beneficial for yourself and everyone else. That's what I think is going on, at least at this point. I think, no, I feel like you're right. I think everything does have. It's so extreme like the way things sensory experiences now, like with TVs and phones, I think everything does have a feeling that's similar to being on psychedelics to the point that maybe they will just be these dimensions that are similar, like, you know, and we won't be able to differentiate, and I do think that this world that we're living in is a type of illusion anyway.

So, but I do think like there's a reason all these things are happening, I feel. I think it's a really good, it's interesting to watch. Like sometimes I get caught up in it, but the mindfulness side of it, I feel is to just observe what's going on, not get caught up in it. Although, then it's like a lot of, I wonder, it's like, shouldn't we fight for what we believe in, but then it's like getting caught up into in the illusion of what's happening. And that's where I have a hard time trying to figure out like how, like, what to do. So like if, classic, right? This is the, this is such an important, such an important part in anyone's lives when they start asking that life, when they start asking that question, because it's like exactly, what do you do?

But damned if you do, damned if you don't. So if you detach completely, you're not really helping. So what I've noticed in a lot through this podcast, a lot of, through people who I've worked with and helped with, with the, what really people who really seem to be engaged, and I've done a lot of work through mindfulness, through meditation, through various practices, chanting, studying, almost all of them without fail or activist in some way. It's not like they have pulled back from reality at all. Even Rambas, I know for a fact that Rambas still engages with the world. He's got a picture of Donald Trump on his Pooja table.

Like he knows what's going on in the world. He stays up to date. And there is not a detachment from society. That's not to say that you don't go pursue your own path on an island in a cave. If that's your calling, that's what you do. But there, it really does seem like people, the more deeper they get into their inner worlds, the more they realize that it is something you need to do out in the world. But the necessary first step is to get your shit straight as best you can with yourself. Because then when you go into a situation, you're not adding a whole bunch of other ship by accident. You know, this is like the whole compassion thing.

Part of being compassionate sometimes is if you see someone on the street and they're bleeding out, you know, there's, if you're a doctor. By all means, go and help that person and go and help them otherwise. But like you don't want to perform surgery on them. If you don't know what the fuck you're doing, you can make it worse. So you basically, it is the first step as I see it and everyone has echoed this, people I consider incredibly smart, incredibly wise, start with yourself. Start doing the inner work. When things come up in your own life through your awareness or through relationships or through anything, deal with those things, investigate those as to the best of your ability.

Try different things to make your life, you know, as peaceful and tranquil as you can. And then look for the things that really call out to you. Some people, you know, see animal cruelty and injustice and like that's their calling. That's it. That's the thing that they have to do. They're going to help. They're going to, you know, work at the Humane Society or set up a no kill shelter, you know, become vegan for ethical or whatever it is. So it's, I think, I think if you start to do that, then you'll naturally be in tune. The goal is like basically get as clear and pure without getting attached to the idea of being as clear and pure as possible because if you're attached to the idea of I need to be like this, you know, this is my idea of a pure in person.

This is what you see in the New Age community, right? This is where everyone gets so airy, fairy and like, it's just like, it's just too over the top like, you know, like, yes, this is, it is the, I don't know, it's interesting because I feel like I may have gotten like initially, I think I got excited and I'm an art director and my fiance feel is the creative director, which is kind of the same thing like we do graphic design and we do art and we create experiences visually and I felt this need to be an activist. And in my initial thoughts about this, I thought I would have to leave what I was doing to be an activist, but then it just hit me like, what am I thinking?

Like, this is my medium, like the reason why I gravitate towards visuals is because that's how I'm going to channel information or transmit information, but it's that initial idea like, oh, I have to leave and, you know, like become a hippie or something. Like, you know, I have to change my career path, you know. Exactly. It's the options that we build for ourselves and you don't like, so let's talk about, let's talk about your artistic side to is one of my favorite things to talk about. And I think, you know, especially with the visual medium, one of the reasons I really love it is that's a big way that symbols that they're symbols that's how we integrate in complicated ideas, concepts, things that don't have words attached to them, which come after symbols, right, we don't, we have to learn letters, we have to learn how to put them those things together, the things that looks like THE into the, we have to figure out how to do that consciously.

Symbols emanate unconsciously. This was one of Carl Jung's biggest thing, like he, he started drawing and painting incredible mandalas just from his dreams. He didn't like go to an art class and like, I need to learn how to paint. So these things emanate from another part of our psyche, which we're not always in tune with, but nevertheless exist. So talk about, how did you get into the artistic side of yourself? Like, how did that, first of all, where did you, where did you grow up? I grew up in Los Angeles, like outside of LA and then I always, I was involved in music a lot in art and at the time it was considered to be kind of this thing that you wouldn't make money doing.

And so my parents kind of pushed me the opposite direction, but I ended up doing graphic design because it was like, you know, combining business and art. What did your parents want you to do? I don't know. I think that they were just worried, you know, like they just, like normal parents. Like, we don't really know what that is, like, so we're worried. And then I ended up studying in London for a while and I studied there just because I felt like music and a lot of things were inspiring me that were coming out of there in fashion. And then I think I've never been the greatest with, like, words or I can use words in a written way, but I've never been able to, like, have quick comebacks or, you know, like, I love words and I really admire people who are wordsmiths and I think it's so beautiful and people can just communicate everything that's going on, like, in the moment.

I feel like you're really good at doing that. But yeah, like just choosing words. And for me, that's like a more visual process in my mind when I'm speaking. Sometimes I see them and then I choose them. So it comes out, it's like a different process. So I think visuals have always been my more natural way of communicating and it's always been more through illustration, but then graphic design. I think it's organizing, like, trying to be a medium for a meaning to come through visually. And then I think I feel like it's something about it is creative/ancient. Because I think it's something that I've always had and it's something, it's my only thing that I feel really comfortable with.

So I don't, and whereas speaking has always felt a little bit more like I've had to learn it. Like clunky. Yeah, it's clunky. I like speaking. I love connecting with people, but I don't feel like I have to be a great talker to do it. I can just sit and, like, you know, hang out. I won't get the vibe of someone rather than how to communicate. I mean, I had, it's a period of my life where I was fundamentally with all zest and all sincerity just was convinced words were useless. I was like, they're just this abstraction that we use. They're totally like, I know they're cool and I know poetry is a creative.

It's so great. It's beautiful. Like, but like, I, they're totally useless. They're just obscuring and messing up what people are trying to communicate anyway, which I think on some level is true, but I get what you're saying. Like, I mean, words can be an imprecise tool for trying to communicate an emotion or a feeling or an idea. So I totally, I totally get that. And a lot of it is filler. Like I feel like words can be, I just sometimes feel people use them too much because I enjoy just being with people without, I mean, not that you want to sit in awkward silence all time. But I don't, I think because it's never been my strength, I'm okay with just like hanging out and having like really easy conversation, but I don't have this like, me, me, me, like I needed.

She's right. But then I think I just got, I'm so comfortable visually and I love, I really admire other creators, so I think like just getting, I started working in fashion. I started working with people that were creating visually beautiful magazines and helping them get across their point. And then I started to kind of feel like I was working corporate a lot, like after a certain point. And then I started to realize I was just, I don't want to say dead inside because I wasn't because I realized like this is for me. But I think that a lot of people now are realizing that it's, you're just a tool kind of when you're working for some of these big companies that don't respect like the artistic medium.

And you're just doing things for marketing and without this point, because I like working for magazines because there's this activist side where you want to like get out really important messages and you're working with people that have a lot to say, but when you're working for a clothing brand or, you know, people who don't, who just want to make money. Right. Right. And that's what it comes down to. People who just want to make money, I think that's where my life changed when I realized I never want to do that again, because I think that's where you really, there's no intention and the intention to just make money, I think.

It's weird. It's weird. It's a really dark energy to me, like, I don't even know what that is, but it makes people do things, there's kind of others. If you're only intention is to make money and then you're not making money as a company, then things aren't so good. But if your intention is for something bigger, well, and not to mention that money, I mean, the way I view it is a form of energy that can be used in service of a lot of things. But if your only primary goal is to accumulate as much of it as possible, and let's be clear, like, that's usually a power thing. People who do that-- It is power, yeah.

They're trying to fill some fear or void or insecurity with the seeming, the power that money can seemingly bestow upon people. And it can do a lot of things. But I mean, the easiest way-- I mean, what never made sense to me about the money is I've seen and been around rich people who are just completely miserable, right? And if you've ever been around-- Me too. And it's like you immediately realize there's no direct correlation between having money and being happy. Like, yeah, there's-- and don't get me wrong, like, if you're poor and you don't have a lot of money, you know, getting an extra few thousand dollars a month is totally different.

Like, that's-- Of course. That's the best level of needs, but we're talking about people who have millions of dollars or more. Exactly. Yes. And there's a distinction there. I think I read a study a while ago, it's like the optimal amount of money to make in the US is $70,000. Once you make any more than that, you're like, happiness, whatever your basic needs is, like, minuscule, how much happier you get. But once you hit kind of that level, but most of your basic needs are taken care of, medical things, food, family, shelter, like, you're good. And I thought that was really interesting that, like, after that, it's, like, so much harder.

Like, you don't get happier the more you make. So, yeah, I mean, money is a weird thing. I used to-- my relationship with money has changed throughout my life. I used to think that it was the root of all evil, that this is the thing that corrupts people more than anything else. It's not. It's not. It's just an energy like anything else. And there's nothing wrong with having money and being abundant and helping people. I mean, one of the coolest things about money, in my opinion, is that we can use it as a token of our gratitude or generosity. Exactly. You know, exactly. I think that's awesome. It's a cool thing about it.

So, but I know what you're saying. It's not even about, yeah, it's not about money. I think, like, I was working in an environment where that was the only intention. Right. Right. And it was in a row, like, I just was, you know, working with different clients. And then I realized, like, it's fine because I think if you have a-- people have this innate sense of knowing, like, if your intention is of a place of compassion or not. Right. And if it's of genuine creative energy or if it's this inauthentic, like, you just want to make money. So, I think, like, that's how you-- like, if you do want to make money, you should think about something you really care about.

Well, it's-- Because I think you're more likely to probably make money and have longevity. And that's-- and basically, Phil and I have been working with a lot of clients who do have this intention, like, a strong activist mindset. Yeah. And because of that, every-- they have people followers. Right. Because those followers know that there is this greater part of the story. And yeah, they do make a lot of money. And I like working with those people because that wasn't why they're doing what they're doing. Right. And that, I think, is those are the type of people who interests me the most. I want to say I like the most, but they interest me the most because you can go about your life and do a lot of different things.

Everyone has the ability, whether they realize it or not, to set their sights on something and do it. That can be anything. Like, truthfully, I mean, you know, physical limitations aside, like, you can pretty much do when you set your mind to. But the intention and the aspiration is the key component. If you don't have that straight, you're setting yourself up more often than not for disaster. Because you don't know why you're doing something. If you don't know why you're doing it, it becomes something that controls you. Because you're not in control of it. You don't have any understanding of what's going on.

So that's, I think, that's hugely, hugely important. It's awesome you get to work with people like that, too. For the most part, I've been lucky enough in my life to work with those people, too. It's really-- it's incredible. It really is. So it is incredible, and also, I think, from a business standpoint, we've had to work on a lot of different pitches and ideas and a lot-- most of the ideas that have not made it are from those that don't have that intention from a good place. But they're people who are really well-funded and, you know, those that have, like, billions of dollars, but they can't make the idea take off because there wasn't this authentic option.

Yes, that's going to say-- and there's-- I mean, we've worked on a lot of those. So I think it's really interesting, like, just as-- for people who are interested in starting a business, I think that's really something important. Like, you're-- I love what you're doing. I think there's-- you'll make billions. Yeah, that's why I started. I actually started this podcast, too, so I could make so much money, you know? That was my prime-- people asked me, "Why did you do this? You know, where did you get the idea?" I was like, "Money? Just want to be really rich, stunt on people. What do you think? Why else would I do it?"

No, but I think it's from the heart. So I think there will be longevity, and I think there will-- money will be a byproduct. And I've noticed something, too, and I imagine you realize-- you come across this with people you work with, truthfully, if you don't have expectations, you can have the intention and aspiration to do anything you want, and you confuse those things together in a lot of ways. But the less you expect, the happier you are in life is my mantra, because expectations in any way can just take you out of the present moment, because it's comparing and contrasting what is going on.

Did this meet the story I told in my head to what is actually happening? And that's where so much fucking suffering comes from. So I do, for the most part-- and let's just be perfectly clear, as much as I say that, and that sounds great-- I check my podcast stats all the time. I check-- you know, I try to make sure I have my client base and the products I'm working on. I focus on that, too, so I'm practical, but I really do try to try to check myself to make sure that, like, don't expect anything. Like, remember the reasons that you do this stuff. Remember what the ultimate intention-- and my intention, you know, all kidding aside, with this podcast and my iPod network, is basically to provide a platform and a place where people can connect to something that makes sense to them.

And that's all these are. That's what these conversations are. They're just us talking about things that are important to us, that have helped us and have meant to a lot of us in our life. And that, to me, in my life, I've experienced both digitally and in real life. If you operate from that place and that space, people will get attracted to it and in a good and positive way. And they'll pick up on the same thing you're talking about. It's not an inauthentic way. This isn't a money grab. This isn't something to fulfill some, you know, deep, horrible, ego void that I need to be popular or something like that.

Those are the things that when you can get through as an individual, when you can get through that bullshit and find the things that you really love and care about, maybe it's not your career path, but it's something you can do and pursue. You'll be happy. You'll have meaning to your life. You'll have fulfillment. That's a big thing. I see a lot of people struggling with like, how do you live a life of meaning? You know, how do you, how are you fulfilled in life? A lot of people think it's money. A lot of people think it's power. A lot of people think it's another person, a lot of people. And all of those things can be part of it.

But it's really something in yourself that once you kind of find that symbol or thing that represents what you want to communicate and live that way, when you operate from that space, I really, truly believe that like magical things happen. And like the most woo, woo sense of the word, like I've seen it, seen it with myself. I've seen it with other people. So yeah. Me too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. But I wonder, like, and I was just thinking because I feel the same as you do, like sometimes I do check my stats for work and I check and I do get caught up in that. And that's some, and that part, I sometimes like do, I take a step back and like, who am I?

Like, why do I, why do I care so much about this? And there is that sense where it's like, it's okay. Like that's a part of our work. And yeah, like sometimes we do, I, cause I do some, it's a battle. Right. And then I feel like kind of like, am I, what am I trying to fill here? Right. Like, why am I so interested in all this? And I guess that's like mindfulness and this environment of like, where you can actually track things now, like before, I don't know how people used to track stuff, but the fact that we can track everything is kind of scary. And that's where I'm like, how, and I know mindfulness is like this, you know, hot word, but you know, having social mindfulness, social media mindfulness and like digital mindfulness, like, what is that?

I don't even know. Here's how I look at it. I, here's how I look at it. And I'm not a huge meditator, but I've done it enough to get a few things out of it or notice a few things. The way I look at social media, kind of compulsiveness, compulsive behavior, checking stats, checking, how many Instagram likes, whatever it is, how many followers, how many people, whatever it is. And I do the same thing. I'm totally neurotic about my Twitter followers, totally neurotic. People have no idea, but I look at it the same way in meditation when you're sitting. Sometimes you sit and everything is just flowing and it's awesome.

And it's like, oh my God, transcendental experiences, I'm connected to the entire universe. And sometimes you sit down and your thoughts are just like total classic monkey mind. Like, what the fuck? What is that? Oh my God, I can't do this. It's really hard. It's the key that I found from teachers who are really great at mindfulness. That is actually a wonderful thing that's happening because it provides an opportunity for you to say, oh, I kind of lost myself for a second. Let me start over. And that is the experience of life. So when it comes to social media, you could look at it and be like, yeah, I'm checking all this stuff way too much, you know, it's not too good.

But when you catch yourself thinking that you can say, oh yeah, why am I doing this? What's happening here? Maybe I don't need to do this right now or maybe I'm doing this for a specific reason. And then maybe you get it clear in your head at that point why you're doing it. Like I remind myself when I look at this podcast that like, when I get really neurotic about it, I'm like, well, why, why, I need more episode downloads. I need this, but I need that. What I do is I try to remember, why am I doing this podcast in the first place? Is it a good thing that I want to get more downloads? So I just want more downloads.

So I feel better about myself or our downloads a reflection of the interest in this, which validates what I think I'm doing for this. And if it aligns with the latter, then at least I have an altruistic intention for checking it and I can alter the frequency of why I'm doing it. The trick is is to not delude yourself into making, and I'm the best excuse and deluder of all time. Like I can argue anything with myself to make it make sense truthfully. I try to be very aware and mindful of why I'm doing it. Don't let me kind of let my ego co-op something that is fun and gratifying because it's true.

Like, when you get, you know, I work on social media a lot, I work on digital strategy. I work on web traffic. When you hit and you get a win, when you make a lot of money for a client, when you do hit something that's really popular with people, it's really helping people, you get a dopamine rush. And that's like anything like you can get really physiologically addictive. So just being aware of that and having some type of awareness to what's going on is a good thing. I think one of my favorite Tibetan teachers, I saw him talk, "Minger Rinpoche," he's got a great book called "The Joy of Living."

And he does this awesome thing where he's like, "You know, when you find you're lazy, when it comes to meditation or you feel like it's a big deal," he's like, "That's great. First of all, realize that's an awesome thing. You're like totally advanced that you can even recognize that." Second of all, instead of getting all stressed out about it and freaked out about it, just look at it lately. And then after you've looked at it lately, play with it. Make a game out of it. And I'm a big video game player. Anything I can tear into a game-like thing, like, "Oh, let me see if I can not get mad at Donald Trump's ignorance.

Let me see if I am good enough at this game to not get mad." You can actually, it's interesting how you can start to see the world. So that's my only limited advice. And I want to say when I talk about these things, it is an ongoing battle and struggle in my own life. I am not giving this advice from a place of, "I figured it out, do this, I'm a genius. You know, follow my five steps to a happier life." But these are things that I've noticed have at least calmed down some of the obsessiveness or an eroticness about it or at least making myself okay with it until it dissipates or I have a healthier way of engaging with it.

That's the place I come from with this type of stuff. And I think that's great advice that's actually, I've tried to do the same thing. Like yesterday I was on the phone or I was on my phone checking in stats or something. And Phil, my fiancé was next to me doing the same thing. And then for a moment I saw us sitting next to each other on our phones. And I judged us and I was like, "We're sitting here we are sitting next to each other on our phones and we're not even communicating." And I kind of felt this, I felt bad because you know, like, "Who are we to be doing this?" But then it's just like that judgment isn't playful and I do think that it doesn't, why be so hard on ourselves?

Like I think we're in this digital age and also it is human. We have self-awareness when you do realize that you're doing things like that. Just be like, "Okay, the phone down, phone down." It's, I mean, I try, the way I look at it again, it's like dreams or it's like psychedelics. If you are on a psychedelic and you get into a negative thought pattern of judging yourself and other people, you're going to have a shit time. The same way that if you're, it's heightened and, you know, multicolored in a psychedelic experience, the same stuff we do that when we're awake, we just don't realize that we're doing it.

And you can dig yourself into a very deep hole of judging that doesn't feel good. And like there's an element when you see yourself with your fiance, with Phil, you know, doing that, there's an aspect that is totally correct. Well, maybe we should be communicating a little more. Maybe, you know, but maybe we don't have to never do this. Maybe we want to both have some independent time and this is how we do it even if we're next to each other, which is kind of cool. It's just looking at it from as many different perspectives to figure out which one feels the best and like you don't have to pick right the first time.

That's the beauty of it. You don't have to say like, well, I fucked up with both on our phones. It's like, well, maybe we could try to do it a little bit less for a week and see if that has any substantial benefit, you know, it's, it's having a lightness to things that I think ultimately allows them to be more fluid and you can kind of go with the flow for lack of a better word. All right. We're, I mean, we're already an hour in. I, what we're going to do is obviously you're coming back on at a later date. So I, I know. I have so much. I know. I know. You see, you say you're not good with words, but we could talk forever here.

So all right. I'm going to end with four questions. I've expanded it. It used to be one. And now it's four. So the first three are really easy and then the fourth one's a little harder. So the first question is, what's your favorite color? Um, I don't have one. I like rainbows. Okay. Multicolored. We'll totally accept that. That's, I love that spectrum. Full spectrum. Yes. Okay. So what is your favorite number? Um, I like the number nine, but I never, I just now thought that. Okay. Oh, there you go. Number nine. Yeah. What is your favorite animal? Um, I like deer, but yeah, I don't know again, that just came out.

And I'm not, these aren't like written in stone. So it's not like you're forever known as someone who only likes deer. So or the number nine, so like there's flexibility to collect deer. So I actually really like deer, I don't, and then people, you know, when you collect them and then people start giving them to you, you're kind of over it. And then when things you're still super into it, it still happens. So if you're listening, she doesn't even, Lulu doesn't need any more deer. Oh, it's so funny. All right. So then the last question is, if, what is something, basically, what's your favorite what's a practical tip or some advice you could give to someone listening that has helped you in your life in a significant way?

Um, one of my mentors, Barbara, she's one of my women, I'm in a woman's group. And she's from the sixties, she's a landscape designer. And she gave me the best advice ever. She said, Rose, we were talking about Rose bushes. And then she said, the way to do it is just, you know, trim them a little bit, but then just let them do their own thing. And that's when they're the most beautiful. And I thought that whenever I start getting, you know, judgy or I find myself frustrated with someone, I'm just like, you know what, they're just doing their own thing. I got to let them do their own thing. And you have to like support yourself in doing that too, for yourself.

No, that's, that fits in line with what we were just talking about, the lightness, right? That's exactly. That's awesome. So awesome. Yeah. Thank you. Hey, that was a good episode. I mean, I know it's a little weird for me to say an episode of my own podcast was a good episode, but I, I feel it was, hence I am saying it. Thank you for everyone who's listened. Next week got some news for you guys who listened past the music. I'm going to do a little Alan Watts thingy, my jiggy. The online shop for Alan Watts is launching, helped put it together. Lulu L also helped. That's why I'm mentioning it here.

So we're in beta right now with the shop, but it's gone really well. So if you're an Alan Watts fan, I think you're going to enjoy it. If you don't know who Alan Watts is, you'll hear a little clip of some of what he has to say. He has gone to the world beyond, but still some of his talks, I mean, still some of my favorite stuff. I put him up, but I'll give you my big three for talks in no particular order. We got Alan Watts, right, we got Rambas, amazing, and Terrence McKenna, those three for me, if you sat me down, I could only listen to three people talk, those would be the three. So Alan Watts, happy to present some stuff for you next week.

So stay tuned for that next week. Cool stuff, fun guests, continuing this podcast. So thanks for listening and I will see you next week. The world's biggest soccer tournament has arrived, and you can trade the entire tournament on Kalshi. Argentina is currently trading at over 8% to win at all, meaning a $100 trade pays out over $1,000 if they win soccer's biggest prize. On Kalshi, you're trading against other people in a live market, no house, no wants makers. For a limited time, download the Kalshi App and use code hoops to get $10 when you trade 10. K-A-L-S-H-I, Kalshi, trade the beautiful game.

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